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The Jason & Scot Show - E-Commerce And Retail News

Join hosts Jason "Retailgeek" Goldberg, SVP Commerce & Content at Razorfish, and Scot Wingo, Founder & Executive Chairman at Channel Advisor, as they discuss the latest news and trends in the world of e-commerce and digital shopper marketing.
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Now displaying: April, 2018
Apr 18, 2018

EP128 - TopHatter CEO Ashvin Kumar

We caught up with Ashvin Kumar at the ShopTalk 2018. Ashvin is the co-founder and CEO at Tophatter an innovative live action site for mobile shoppers.  With the engagement and psychology of a game and the economics of a marketplace, Tophatter generated over $300 million of GMV in 2017 (100% up on 2016) and sells 100,000+ items every single day.  We talked with Ashvin about his background, including his previous start-up Blippy.  The pros and cons of various auction format and how Tophatter appeals to it's entertainment seeking value oriented shoppers.

Episode 128 of the Jason & Scot show was recorded on Tuesday, March 20, 2018.

http://jasonandscot.com

Join your hosts Jason "Retailgeek" Goldberg, SVP Commerce & Content at SapientRazorfish, and Scot Wingo, Founder and Executive Chairman of Channel Advisor as they discuss the latest news and trends in the world of e-commerce and digital shopper marketing.

New beta feature, Google Transcription:

Transcript

Jason:
[0:25] Welcome to the Jason and Scott show this episode is being recorded on Tuesday March 20th 2018 I'm your host Jason retailgeek Goldberg and as usual I'm here with your co-host Scott Wingo.

Scot:
[0:37] Hey Jason and welcome back Jason Scott show listeners we are live live live from shoptalk and Las Vegas excited to have on the show.
Ashvin is the top Hatter co-founder and CEO and tophatter is the world's most entertaining Marketplace they've raised over 35 million in venture capital and we're really excited to hear your story hear about tophatter and talk about,
marketplaces machine learning in a variety of other topics welcome to the show action.

Ashvin:
[1:06] Thank you and thanks for having me Jason Scott have to be here.

Jason:
[1:10] We are thrilled to have you so one of the ways we almost always start out the show is get a little bit of the background of our. So can you tell us sort of how you started your career and found your way to this.

Ashvin:
[1:23] Sure so I'll let I'll start at the at the very very top so I was born and raised in in Silicon Valley.
Local kid that that that never left the Bay Area basically there's there's not too many of us a lot of lot of folks descending on the Bay Area these days so I got to grow up in Palo Alto.
Went to Palo Alto High School I was in I was in the valley and that the.com.
Bubble and I remember I'm there is just remember there was a big there just weren't enough programmers and like the in hanging like the 99 2000 time and I remember getting your coffee.
When your programmers you know how to write Java and I was like.
Yes and I had no idea when got a book studied about the week before got in there and started learning job at up the I make great money that sell rather this is awesome and so that's where the bug started for me.

Jason:
[2:23] Will assume job I was like a required freshman class at Palo Alto High School now.

Ashvin:
[2:27] You know what's interesting at we we did do a little a little programming it at pellets high school so we had a little bit of that there but not a ton it wasn't quite as in Vogue as it is now.
I know I think computer science is like Stanford's largest major by far and certainly the flavor of play for the decade.
Yeah so after Polly Went to went to Stanford computer science Stanford actually while I was there I was interned at Amazon.
That's where that's where my co-founder and I first spent a lot of time together he was an internet.
At Microsoft and I was an intern at Amazon and so we decided to split the difference in.
And find a place to live in between the two so we lived in the University District in Seattle.
And every every night we come back and talk about the differences between Microsoft and Amazon which is awesome and I had a fantastic 2003.
Does neutering there for a few months and it was it was already felt like a fairly big company with a lot of but still plenty of opportunity ahead of them and I remember.
I want one thing I'm a Jeff Bezos would talk to the entire episode that has been.
Like one of the treats was he come and talk to all the entrance and we talked about some some the company values and that there's two that I'm a really well as a frugality and Trust.
And an enzyme I'm ever just wanted to hit like a soda need to go pay for stuff.

Jason:
[3:55] Obviously like I'm imagining you comparing notes with your roommate and like the cafeteria on the Microsoft campus was a little fancier than the free bananas at Apple at Amazon.

Ashvin:
[4:04] Do it what about that but what I found fascinating was that they were proud of that fact and so it just it just.
You got me so it got me excited.
Three different perspective than one person's proud of their reality and Microsoft obviously was touting there free food and free soda just two companies with very very different mindsets obviously.
So after I graduated from Stanford where I worked at a small startup Enterprise social networking startup for for 3 years I would some of the so my friends from Stanford is the 3rd engineer.
When I join we had about 7 people.
I reread the series day we spend three years building the company in about.
3 years 23 years and my co-founder and my current co-founder and I decide to leave our job he went to.
You went to a different start up use also 3rd engineer there so between us we had seen a couple we felt like we were the ground for a couple companies.

Scot:
[5:07] Is this the same guy that was also a Microsoft intern.

Ashvin:
[5:09] Single room the other after after college to and so after.

Scot:
[5:13] This is like Millennials like this.

Ashvin:
[5:16] Under that bastard us.

Scot:
[5:17] Best friends for life come on get with the lingo your conversation.

Ashvin:
[5:25] Do we have till we die.
After after work it out of respect of guys to come back and jam on ideas together and eventually about two and a half years and we decided that we we want to.
Tried on a run so we are we just started working hacking on various different projects and all all we knew is that we wanted to work together and that we wanted to build something fun.
I interesting that people are going to like those sort of but that was a starting point but we didn't really know what that look like.
And so we just are working on stuff we build stuff and we just put it in front of anybody that would it would see for feedback.
We that weed weed send users to it and all sorts of ways that we can find a post on Facebook and post on Twitter viral things to try and get user to user experience.
In the process of that was like right around $2,000 this is like the financial crisis.

Scot:
[6:18] Great time to start compass.

Ashvin:
[6:19] Yeah.

Scot:
[6:21] Just leave her jobs and start a company in early 2000s.

Jason:
[6:24] Frugality.

Ashvin:
[6:27] Actually move back in with my with my parents my co-founder you move back here.
You also trying to save money on on rent so he moved in with his girlfriend at the time.
Way too early to move in with a girlfriend and they're married now so everything worked out but.
Be trying to be frugal a hack on stuff share with anybody that would see it in the process we met if you see it at CRV and they weren't like they were doing a lot of deals at the time of the crisis.
So things are a little slow there and they had a spare office in at the their office is on Sandhill and so is he invited us to come work out of their office.

Scot:
[7:16] Sweet and nice.

Ashvin:
[7:18] CBS on basic being in Resident entrepreneur I don't like to say I don't like say unfriend resident because that's like a fancy title where you actually get paid we were at in Resident on foreigners.

Jason:
[7:27] That's like the difference between a country club and a club in the.

Ashvin:
[7:29] Exactly.
I got a big chunk of our day was figuring out which coffee shops wife I wasn't going to cut out so having like condition Wi-Fi and free lunch actually was really helpful.

Scot:
[7:46] I spent a lot of time at the Starbucks in Palo Alto on I'm picturing you guys when I go in there it's like funny it's like all these startup books just kind of like you know you can see the founders and they're just like you know.
Hey they have big red circles on it.

Jason:
[8:07] And now everyone has to be in the official Patagonia down vest.

Ashvin:
[8:11] But siding I stack that standard BC attire.

Scot:
[8:14] Yeah that's a b c.

Ashvin:
[8:15] Tina Turner wearing the Patagonia vest.

Scot:
[8:17] Depth of funny humorous t-shirts yes I write Piper.

Ashvin:
[8:22] So much of products in 2000 and in 2008.
And when the benefits was being a b c Verma said we could we just walked down the hallway and showed us these.
The folks there in got their feedback and eventually we found we we built something that they got really excited about that's why if we actually ended up raising money for it so it's probably called blippi,
and it was a it was a social network for the type for the things that people are buying so the idea there was that we would.
We would Connect into your your Amazon account your iTunes account and we basically passed we published your friends the stuff that you were buying so if you download something about the man so I'm kind of out your friends way of discovering what your friends are by.
As I was going by first foray into Discovery shopping and we got really excited about that and and CRV got really excited about that and they wrote us a check to see if from the company and that's how we got started so they put.

Scot:
[9:25] Serbia's Charles River Ventures for those of you that aren't in that VCU Palo Alto.

Ashvin:
[9:30] So what we raise money for that and and actually we got a lot of traction initial traction a lot of hype around that product.
And 6 months later we raise another round for that sweet we actually ended up raising $12 additional for that.
Unfortunately six months after that after spending so this one year into the journey with blippi like we realize it but the product wasn't really going to work.
So the retention numbers weren't there the engagement just wasn't there when we tried a bunch of things so by the end of that year we had a we had a lot of money in the bank but filled product.
And so we have to figure out what we're going to do next and Mike O'Connor and I we just kind of went back to what we were doing before it was hacking on all sorts of different projects.

Scot:
[10:16] It's a blippi was a consumer, thing did you try pivoting till like retailers integrating with their platform to do a staring contest.

Ashvin:
[10:23] Yeah could question so there were a few different ways we could have hit it I think that at that time we we still felt really strongly that we wanted to be if your consumer experience and we didn't want to have a component where we were doing an Enterprise Integrations or working closely with.
With folks without us having restaurant user base.

Scot:
[10:42] Did was of oxidation like to an affiliate program. I think so Jason shares of cool GadgetEase bought I buy it you guys have been coded in the affiliate link.

Ashvin:
[10:51] That would be one possible promise at scale and then we it was such a treasure Trove of information.

Jason:
[10:56] I can say there's probably a data play where you're quick.

Ashvin:
[10:59] It was it was.
Is really fun products only only first build it and then other things that we buy every single day at the amount of like apps I download on the Play Store things that I just go on Amazon buy.
Based on a recommendation from a friend or you know somebody recognizes me a book I'll just go buy it on the Kindle right now and have so I can have it there with one when I'm on the plane to like you're buying things all the time and are.
Product would pull all that information in Niagara that information published in a structured way to other people could benefit from it.

Scot:
[11:34] Remember Facebook Beacon where they tried this and then a people to buy gifts for their wives or wife's.

Ashvin:
[11:42] Storage associate with it too but but all in all it was really fun product with a lot of information associate with it and there were a lot of different directions we could take it,
the reason why we like there's a guy that had the fun engaging element that also had fantastic quantization potential.
If you want use a product then so I can work and then that's where but we found we found it we can get people to initially engaged to the product but we couldn't get them to retain overtime.
And so at the end of the year we've had some decisions to make when we decided to have basically Sunset the product and work on other things but we were really excited about probably really excited about the space of Discovery Commerce.
I'm just at this the area that we stayed in and we started working on other ideas in an e-commerce so the next idea we tried we tried a bunch of things in between the next thing that we got a little bit of traction was we we we took the idea of Groupon and.
Combined it with base e tried to build a Groupon like experience for Etsy sellers because he's at the sellers have fantastic.
Merchandise they can make me a sandwich. But I have no distribution so we that will look spell the distribution list.
For people that want to be introduced to new types of Pepsi products and so that actually was awesome we lost that in 2011.
And I had really great traction for a few months but then a few months in we realize that this is actually hitting a ceiling that we just we can't.
We can't attract enough Sellers and we can't get enough people on the distribution list to make this a scale at at a meeting for 8.

[13:12] I've been so 6 months after that we realize I can't wait this business or the tapped out even though it had some initial traction and we work and we went back to the drawing board works on a bunch of other consumer.
Consumer products all in all in Discovery shopping and then 2012 is when we launched tophatter.
And I'm we launched tophatter I had to lift head like a consumer heads consumer attraction in a list that we had not seen before.
And then we'd work to my way to work then we work on so many different projects up to this point that when we when we initially launch shop in and saw the numbers were like wow there is something special here,
I wouldn't know exactly what about it is Piggly special but there's something really special here that we want to that we want to make sure that we capture in Foster.

Scot:
[13:53] And so as a as a function or in the consumer space What are the numbers you're looking at so you've talked about you.
Retention stuff are you looking at KLTV are you looking at cohort analysis helplessness can't understand how someone building.

Ashvin:
[14:08] So these days as a as a business scales at those are all really important numbers for us or we look at court we look at when we say chords for provokes international.
We look at when a person signs up in month 1 how do they perform in 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 so we look at how that how,
how to progress over time.
We also look at tactile TVs we look at all that stuff but it's mainly like numbers as rescaled up initially When You're Building Products it's it's a little bit more like trying to find love.

Scot:
[14:42] Just some Mau movement.

Ashvin:
[14:43] Yeah you look at you looking for you looking for something special in the product trying to capture trying to capture Magic In A Bottle.
And I think if you don't have that initial magic in the model of then all that other stuff doesn't really all that other stuff doesn't really make sense. It's hard to optimize for that other stuff.
And so I think the thing that was special. Tophatters at it did have magic in the bottle really early on and and then as we scaled up we use all of you know we look at CAC LTV we look.
All that fancy Jazz figure out if we're doing work on the right things.

Jason:
[15:19] Tell her what's my little bit about tophatter and sore what the value prop is and what what makes you guys doing.

Ashvin:
[15:24] Yeah so tophatter is a I just got to shopping app I always encourage people to to take to go download the app to get the full experience because it's a it's a it's a very differentiate experience we sell things in an in an option where I'm at.
So we're on live auctions 24/7 I think the average eBay auction takes 2 weeks to complete our average auction takes 90 seconds and get us some other price so it's real time is fast.
How are average price points 10 to 15 bucks so it's in like an Impulse impulse purchase.
I don't feel they can make a decision within 90 second see if they want something.
And we sell across the a variety of categories from jewelry to electronics to accessories.

Scot:
[16:07] It seems like it's raining towards of value kind of consumer, like that wish kind of a Marketplace and you'll see some of that wants to have something cool for like under 20 bucks or something.

Ashvin:
[16:16] So are consumers also shop at Walmart and Kohl's and and QVC and HSN and yeah it's it's at the dollar store TJ Maxx when these are all these are all of her consumers so they say it's about you wanting to customer.

Scot:
[16:30] Never while they're there is he's really weird auction sites where you would like by kind of a currency to go to bed and you know I think they gave options are really bad name kind of there.

Ashvin:
[16:38] And we're constantly kind of fighting yeah so we're like we we had to fight that kind of band brand misperception.
Lots of people see that we're not inside that's the first place that's what one of the first question that we get his ass a penny auction sites with a pay for my beds and doing a lot of them are can we make make really clear. Beds are free.
Only pay if you win so it's just an old-fashioned auction but it's not it's not an option for.
For the reasons of price discovery on most items that we sell their free commodity items it's an option because it's engaging and we find that again we think about how we build an engaging experience that's what we started.
It's just fun everything starts at a dollar and so you pick the price they want to pay you know so you like something at a dollar there's no reason why you won't like it at 2 and then if you like it at 3 instead.

Scot:
[17:26] Is it a 1 winner wins got a thing or is it more of a Dutch auction so if Jason did six and I bid 7 we both kind of win or.

Ashvin:
[17:32] Right now it's one winner of the challenge too is that is that if there has to be losers in the auction for you to feel free to feel good when you actually win something.

Scot:
[17:44] That that hurts the you know the pack because she got to go acquiring up cat x x yeah and then it could hurt LTV cuz if I'm a loser lose so many times year.

Ashvin:
[17:54] Better interest in their data shows that the folks that compete for items are the ones that are there are more likely to come back so if you if you try and win something you win something with no competition less likely to come back and if you competed for anyone,
cuz there's a little bit of social validation in the fact that somebody else wanted to sing.

Scot:
[18:11] I saw an article that said you're you guys had over 300 million in DMV in 2017 it was an idea the sky.

Ashvin:
[18:18] Jessica sent a scale so we're going to do so last year we did over 300 million in Top by in this year right now like we're focused on doing a billion dollars in 2019 this year will do at least a half a billion dollars.
It's a no it's not it's not like an Amazon CEO business but it's not like a small business either so.

Scot:
[18:39] And your business model is typical take rate kind of a random.

Ashvin:
[18:43] It's a it's a Marketplace business model we take roughly 25% depending on the category.

Scot:
[18:49] So then I can figure out your revenues by multiplying GMB by 25% just making sure I understand.

Jason:
[18:59] That would assume that Scott can do math.

Scot:
[19:01] Yes and then are you guys a mix of first party and third-party entirely third party.

Ashvin:
[19:11] It's an entirely third-party give me like our sellers do we sell things ourselves.

Scot:
[19:13] Yeah yeah.

Ashvin:
[19:15] So we don't take any inventory your Marketplace we just connect buyers and sellers so we asked her sellers to give us all their inventory so we tell sellers.
Give us a spreadsheet everything you got and then destroy those into how we use data.
Do we have it we have a big pool of them in Torrey millions and millions of items that we can potentially share with their buyers and then from that we Whittle it down to a small set of a relatively small so excuse that we show fires when they open.

Jason:
[19:45] So how are you soliciting sellers.

Ashvin:
[19:50] Are sellers are Swedish settlers faced in the you asked me if sellers we also have a team in China to work with our sellers in China today,
about 70% of our sales come from sellers that are based in China and leave it to you in there that helps find and work with our sellers. They're actually found is just.
Just looking at the broader internet.
And selling like as a as a third-party sell on the Internet it's just very challenging to find places to sell on the internet there just aren't enough places to sell.
There's some when we go and talk to our sellers in China they're always looking to diversify where they're selling and nobody wants to just be on Amazon.
I prefer for obvious reasons but if you look but you look down unless there's actually not a lot of options Beyond Amazon you got the Amazon you got eBay.
You got a Bye Baby I wish the list rise up pretty quickly and so when we come in there and say that we have no we're going to have to I know ours this year and we've got reasonable volume every two years.
Because a that good volume and be that they wanted they don't want to be wholly dependent on on their Amazon sales.

Jason:
[20:58] So when is Big trans here at shop talk has been Ai and machine learning.
And you guys are like getting a significant amount of data now so that I imagine within an able the possibility of you ever drink some of those techniques.

Ashvin:
[21:15] Death till we have it we have a fantastic day it is at and we have a dataset that's that's different and bigger than a lot of e-commerce.
Players are size because we've got people spinning history to so not only do we have people buying things we have people expressing interest at various different price points along the way.
We have a really expect all data said they're only be getting this to leverage as we get better and better at at machine learning.
But for us via the business is only improved as its scale.
And I attribute that to obviously improvements in logistics and operations that you get his knee Converse business scaling but just as much to to being able to leverage or data in more intelligent.

Jason:
[22:01] When are you likely using that for merchandising as well I cute like so you mentioned like there's a big inventory of potential stuff to offer to your buyers.

Ashvin:
[22:11] Yeah so like internal in our in our company we have nobody we have Noah merchandisers so I think this is one of the one of the Hallmarks as I see it if I can modern.
The modern retail company is it is one that's going to use data my data is the new merchandiser us for one of our internal mottos so.
And we can we learned this the hard way we actually it a few years ago we we did hire some folks with more traditional retail backgrounds and we had a hard time internally reconciling.
The air intuition was laughing right we just had a hard time reconciling that with with the day that we were seeing.
And so it's trying to get these Two Worlds 2 that's it come together as challenging but I think just are we got nowhere we're engineer's by training and that sort of our DNA.
And out we we like to call the numbers and and and only talk about you comes and retail merchandising is like the core piece of that where we do spend a lot of time.

Jason:
[23:09] So have you guys developed any of your own models are you using any of the commercial or Open Source Tax like what's the jewels that you're using.

Ashvin:
[23:17] We use while he's a lot of Open Source.
We do use a lot of open source code to take glue iron machine together but we're not using any off-the-shelf solutions for Ray I so we we build their own data model as we've got Folks at experience machine learning.
I bet spend time tuning the models and then also thinking about how do we like what what types of data would make this model even better,
and how do we go capture that data so a lot of what we talked about internally is Howard data structure and how can we structure it better to make it more effective writing everything.
A lot of people ask me about about data and about a I and I always tell them that it just starts with structured data you got to have a data set and you got to have a schema that's easy to work with.

Jason:
[24:04] We have lots of the sort of more old-world clients in the the starting points for a machine learning isn't even doing any machine.

Ashvin:
[24:12] That can you get the data.

Jason:
[24:13] Just about getting a.

[24:14] Attributes for your data and another thing we talked a lot about because it's a coming problem is it a government so I can just making sure you have the the right rights to leverage that date on all the way she.

Scot:
[24:26] She mentioned can I join in on this so you mentioned you get this did data,
do you actually didn't go and and go to like the manufacturer and say hey your price is too low if you know you're at $12 and if we did 899 you are model tells us we could sell twice the volume is that is that a example to use case.

Ashvin:
[24:45] Yes so we have got me so that is like an example of division we haven't actually gotten it we haven't actually done that just yet but yeah if the core piece of our technology is that we can look at it and I didn't estimate the price that were going to get for it so.
We like to have a good sense of what we're going to sell something for before we even put it up for auction before I buy or even sees it.
And so we can look at our in our million just using save this these are the things that are going to perform well,
I'm can we go get them for for better prices or can we how do we make this how we make these price-points works and they're there two ways that we can figure out how to how to make advertise ask you to sell it at a higher.
Price that we think we can get a better price for or how do we lower the cost on the supply side.

Scot:
[25:28] I'm convinced this is what drives a lot of Amazon private label you know the,
the brands would tell you that they're just stealing their data and stuff but I think what happens is you know I think Amazon looks at like khaki pants and they see there's this conversion gap down at you know X dollars and then they will go and recruit Chinese sellers to fill that Gap and then.
And we're like lahren you know some private label at that price point in there and I think they're looking more of conversion day that you kept getting data with sexy little bit.

Ashvin:
[25:54] What's interesting about Amazon so like we we get compared to when we talk to investors obviously Amazon's the Shelf in the room and they want to talk about how we are different from Amazon Amazon everything is Sartorius on Amazon.
Amazon has his wealth of kind of search oriented conversion day that somebody types in khaki pants and they can see what percentage of the khaki pants search volume has been fulfilled.
We don't have that meeting we just have people open up the app and it's almost like a news feed of products and so we have to clean and we have to clean and make inferences in in in different Amazon.

Scot:
[26:32] So just to change topics little bit so a lot of people contact me cuz I'm known in the marketplace world marketplace.
That's great it's going to be harder than you think it is because unlike you know what say you were going to build like a Dollar Shave Club or something like that what's nice about that business is you you you control one side of the equation right you control the supply Dave's go to bring demand.
You chose the what I would say is at least twice as hard if not for ex's heart of building Marketplace you have to not only do have to go build the buyer side if you could build the seller side so it's kind of like simultaneously building to businesses and you. There's probably some.
Scot rule of the square of the number of sides to marketplaces you know that the exponent of the equation has that been your experience that is kind of getting to the school you're at.
Arrow on one side of the boat too hard and they end up going in a circle to acquire all these fires the bars I have a terrible experience cuz there's not enough Supply logo acquire Ali suppliers they won't sell anything till at RIT because I didn't.
Selling a product you have some scar tissue to share with us.

Ashvin:
[27:37] I absolutely I mean this is like this is what working on all the time so try not trying to climb the ladder on demand and Supply at the same at a similar rate.
On the challenging and visit this is why it's really hard to grow a Marketplace faster than it is very hard to grow,
American pit playset and I can exponential rate it takes time to grow marketplaces until we've been fortunate enough to,
the mostly double the business year of the year and even as we try and double the business of feels like the wheels are about to fall off either on the supply side or on the demand side.
And interrupt you to see some of the conversations that go on internally it's always will be one channel screaming about not enough buyers in another slack Channel screaming about like not enough to use for a certain type of visors just like,
constantly it is it feels like a battle everyday and then when you take a step back and look at the business we actually like.
We actually got some stuff done and we grew even though that every single day feels like it feels like a dog fight.

Scot:
[28:39] Is that the hardest thing about building tophatter or have you been surprised by the back end scale it's taken or the customer Discovery what's been the hardest problem in hindsight that the kind of surprise you.

Ashvin:
[28:56] I made a promise to be changed your every year right now one of my biggest challenges around is trying to understand or Supply better and if so can I go to the data model we see that are 21 a big challenge is this your process.
Dish Network Network routing with this this year is that we are our customers tell us that they want to see more things in the marketplace.
When we first launched in 2012 and keep my everything we do is real time so when you open up that app everything that you're seeing is is available right now in this moment is going to sell the 90 seconds or anybody in the world named in the world that opens up the apps in the sea.

Scot:
[29:29] Just have a QVC as kind of a model.

Ashvin:
[29:32] It's like QVC.
And in a when we first launched in 2012 because we had such a small demand days we can offer that much to fly so if you open up the app in Primetime you know if you open up the app there might be like 5 things for sale.
Because that's all that our demand could so bored and that year,
going to see more than these five things available and then in 2013 or demand a screw and we can put our supply base also and they said the same thing we want to see little bit more so every year it's it's kind of the same thing this year if you'll stick.
because we we see the we see the option to break into all these different categories of issue with this deal that we do have and so,
a lot of what we spoke Asana is trying to understand what categories do art buyers want to see,
how do we get them how we brought in our category how do we go deeper into categories that we do have to sell better and better things so it's it's,
trying to trying to build that Insight while then why like I'll mark while I system is is evolving is it super challenging and we have a pretty big.
You're pretty big team of of analyst that.
Are there looking at data all the time trying to trying to understand how the system is functioning and build more insight into what we should do tomorrow.

Scot:
[30:47] We have a lot of entrepreneurial type sellers that sell on eBay and other platforms give us like the Quick 90-second Pitch like how do you pitch a seller to be on your platform.

Ashvin:
[30:57] Yeah we say jeezy I use give us all your montuori and will we we we we connected with our bye week we look at what are bars in Taiwan.
I'm willing to stop everything is going to do on you can tell us also if you've got a floor for the the things that you want to be like that price that you expect to sell it at and we won't listen unless our production models are telling us that it's and it's all about that rice.

Scot:
[31:19] Set a three hundred million kind of run rate at a lower aov do you have like 30 million to buyers and sellers how many buyers like I kind of wanted to 30 minutes.

Ashvin:
[31:32] Papyrus like last year we had I mean an exact numbers but last year we had over 2 million buyers on the.

Scot:
[31:40] Are the churches buying for a minister.

Ashvin:
[31:42] Did buy a lot of stuff.

Scot:
[31:43] That's awesome yeah that's cool yeah.

Ashvin:
[31:45] Dad and Elvia to get to the point like a 10 lb of 10 bucks I got 10 to 15 hours every transaction size to make this business work they better be buying a lot of things,
and remember the classic thing about e-commerce businesses,
1015 years ago is the first question to ask you what's your HIV and if you're able V is like in the ten to $20 range like.

Scot:
[32:07] Does the seller I would ask one thing that scares me is you know I give you all my inventory and I see all the stuff going on there for a dollar can I have a reserve or or do you guarantee if I want 10 bucks you'll deliver 10 bucks.

Ashvin:
[32:19] Yeah so today on today I currently back a lot of the risk is taken by the sellers but we just Asher sellers that we're not going to run unless we think you're going to get a.
We are prediction models think that you're going to get a price above the price that you want but I want to go rolling.

Scot:
[32:35] Give you a desired price point.

Ashvin:
[32:36] Writes about wanting a rolling out this year is for us to take the risk and so were you know we got all the data we're confident are predictions into at some point in time we feel really comfortable taking the rest and so from.
From from a perspective a seller can treat our platform just like they treat any other.
Marketplace so just like you work with eBay just like you were Vans I just give it everything at the best price that you have and what will sell it and will give you the price for it.
We also have the option to take apps out on it too so.

Scot:
[33:05] So if I'm if I've got a like a great price on this widget and we we,
do this I know when a lot of sellers are working with like the Amazon and eBay deals team there's a certain kind of death what what kind of depth would you ask a seller to provide do you want like 10 of a widget a hundred a thousand and one.

Ashvin:
[33:22] So today we don't work with our Salvage closely for volume commitments that's another opportunity we can have so we we anticipate that as we start to take as we start to give sellers commitment and we're trying to get better prices from seller anticipated volume of famous will go.
Along with it today we do today we get more volume to the sellers that are willing to take more risks.
And they don't have to take that rest me like we're happy to take that risk and so it's a little bit of a kind of value proposition mismatched right now they were excited to address this year.

Scot:
[33:51] The last one is one of the knocks on some of these folks like an AliExpress or a wish is you in this thing and you you're all excited and then like it takes 6 months for the.
How to get to do something you've got that feedback on in and have you work with your sellers on how fast you expect them to ship these things and get them to a consumer.

Ashvin:
[34:10] So we expect the sellers to ship right away doesn't necessarily mean they're going to get it right away the customers that we have.
Longer for value and so we haven't seen the shipping times be a huge problem and I really think there's a Class A customer that wants to get their item right away but those are nicer of those aren't really our customers broadly speed.
Our customers though want value one thing that we we sound is that our Logistics are going to improve what scale.
And so as we scale up we found that are sellers are willing to open up warehouses closer to the man.
And we're willing to give them more volume if they open up their warehouse closer to man into labor faster different ways to get the products to the customers faster and are using a Marketplace model are sellers are willing to,
I'm investing that are averaged it just be clear are average time delivery times are in a couple weeks if it's coming from from China and if it's coming from the US with a bunch of our inventory comes from the u.s. to is Justina today.

Jason:
[35:13] And does the buyers see that delivery time before they did.

Ashvin:
[35:17] And it's an important component so if we tell our sellers that if you can ship faster you're going to do something more to man on your products.

Jason:
[35:25] Cuz I feel like that's an incremental fly in the wish model is like you're off and pretty far in the purchase funnel before you find out.

Ashvin:
[35:33] Yeah you know I think they experimented both ways so I think that take a fairly similar mindset. Some terms of trying to figure out where it where to break this news to the customer quote on quote,
and obviously it's it's pretty bad experience if you break it too late in the funnel but I'm sure they're trying to learn to an experiment with where's the right place though.
Frostburg to share it right up front so people so we set expectations right away.

Jason:
[35:58] So you mention in the beginning I always encourage people to download the app so I'm assuming that's just the sort of preferred iteration of the experiences the mobile app.

Ashvin:
[36:11] Yeah so most of our business is done I mean the real time experience and so we saw things we sell things that are only available for 90 seconds.
And so we do have experience but most are web expenses primarily for our seller so all of our seller tools are on the web and that's how sellers access it and our our website works just the same way that are at this.
Vast majority of our business is done on our apps on on our Android app Android or iOS.

Jason:
[36:40] So almost everybody that has a strong mobile experience I get the metrics are.

[36:45] They're on the mobile app experience the challenge usually is maintaining that that high active user base on the mobile app it sounds like.

[36:57] In your case it kind of matches pretty well to the demographic because he's.

[37:02] People that are that are going to want to be frequent purchase orders are you seeing like significant turn like what are you doing and try to maintain.

Ashvin:
[37:11] Yeah I mean we got a liver specialist Discovery shopping experience together.
We focus on engagement I think this is a big difference between us and Amazon we like to ourselves as the anti Amazon.
And anyways Amazon focus on making things Amazon focus on the buying experience we focus on the shopping experience.
Games on focus on efficiency they want to get you in the app and out of the act like my could you and find something quickly get it boom you're out where the opposite where did we help custom we help our.

Jason:
[37:41] I want to go lighter.

Ashvin:
[37:42] Yep we want we.
Amazon helps you save time tophatter helps you spend time we want to go for us like we want our customers to be in the eyeball time we want them to be discovering great things even if they're not buying and I were constantly iterating on on that experience.
The primary feedback from our customers that they end up turning out is the fact that we don't have the breakfast apply that they're looking for.
And every year that challenge every year like we're able to offer more and more Supply obviously we want to have it overnight love love to have it happen tomorrow but it's it's it's just a process of building outdoor supply this.

Jason:
[38:16] It's interesting the VC's are comparing you to Amazon they may be should be comparing you to like Clash Royale or some.

Ashvin:
[38:21] Maybe there's a there's a game like experience to us.

Scot:
[38:27] Chef fortnite wear like everyone's on an island at the Battle for the deal.

Ashvin:
[38:30] There's a will there's a.

Scot:
[38:32] Fortnite Meats products.

Ashvin:
[38:33] People love the competition.

Jason:
[38:34] Gamification for sure.

Scot:
[38:36] A quick disclaimer Jason Scott show takes 10% of any ideas that utilize from the show that are lawyers make the same things.

Jason:
[38:42] Do you disclose like roughly like what the active monthly users are on the mobile app is it like just I'm just trying idea border magnitude vs. Traditional shopping site.

Ashvin:
[38:54] Yeah I don't want to get there like that monthly numbers.

Scot:
[38:58] Denis Entre Nos RMA you there. You and you you probably know like time of day.

Ashvin:
[39:07] They're absolutely is in and where it where are part of our business is making clever matching the right amount of Supply with the right amount of man so we have two man models that tell us.
How much how many buyers we expect to be showing up,
at this very moment and then what Supply we should be showing in this 90 second time frame so we have these models that tell us how much we should be listening to get that information so we have to know.
We had an all the stator in terms of sharing though we sell over a hundred thousand items today and I just give you a sense.

Scot:
[39:42] Are you limited by the time of anything since 90 seconds there's only so many things you like so many slow.

Ashvin:
[39:50] One the middle the night there's less people on the side there's like less people on the app.

Scot:
[39:53] Like let's say there's 10 people on at anyone given second do they they all see the same thing going for 9 year to you now start just going to say there's some point where it starts to make sense to show some audience maybe a ring and another people at electronic item.

Ashvin:
[40:07] Right so ever so there's there's a everybody has a different sort experience so you can sort down and see you could do that access to everything.
But it was me different place in this world so it's personalized to the person the information we have they said about the person based on what's available at this very moment.

Scot:
[40:25] So you can go broader category and get more personalized and leverage those 90 seconds it seems like.
I going deeper would be good too because you know a lot of sellers I've talked to you the kind of have these fees opportunities to.
They don't see no volume come in there from you which is like where these deal platforms gets these really crazy great prices.

Ashvin:
[40:46] We can sell things in volume to it just won't part of the Beauty from my buyer respective is that if you don't win right now you don't know when that's going to come up again.
And people in by arbovirus and set reminders on certain items so even if they don't win it right now will send the notification the next time it comes up and sometimes the next time it comes up is in the next hour sometimes it.

Scot:
[41:05] Never lose our kind of you know to notify them cuz I've expressed interest yeah for the show it the first thing.

Ashvin:
[41:10] Exactly exactly so so we do we are able to sell things in volume but it isn't this really happen like in the same 90 seconds.

Scot:
[41:17] What what categories do you want to add the most.

Ashvin:
[41:20] Your work cited going to break into apparel for us like we find that.
We think that the experience that we have or what we're trying to cater to a broad mass-market audience but our audience today is limited by the supply that we do sell so a few years ago we were only selling jewelry,
and our audience is 90% women.
I'm now we're selling a lot of electronics in her audience is closer to 6040 male female because there is something for guys to buy and sell.
I'm excited like break into apparel and a bunch of other categories shoes.

Scot:
[41:56] Pro tip hair extensions so hair.

Ashvin:
[42:00] 10% for you guys.

Scot:
[42:01] Go to hair extensions of the number one seller on AliExpress and it's like crazy volumes there's something about the price point in quality of imported from China hair extensions Jason's more of an expert than I am.

Ashvin:
[42:13] I got high.

Scot:
[42:16] It's all about the weave I think you should definitely look at this hair extensions.

Ashvin:
[42:24] We saw a lot of drunks video.

Scot:
[42:24] So drones are second only to two hair extensions.

Ashvin:
[42:30] And I also tried to break in international markets so today were were 85% based in the US we think in many ways the business and be a lot more interesting outside the US.

Jason:
[42:45] Very interesting is a trance personalized at all I can like do you use what you know about the user to decide what gets merchandise on that home page.

Ashvin:
[42:54] Yeah we so so there's there's a set of items is available to everybody that's that is on the app at this given moment but we stored it based on the information that we have about you.
I didn't know if it's you bid on a lot of electronics items you're probably see Electronics items do kind of times that are available you probably see sword at the top so we do our best to personalize it in that way.
We make decisions about the demand that we're seeing today in the supply that we have available we're also.
At Ross magnesia know what from that pool we should be listening to sell at this given moment in time.

Jason:
[43:31] Well this is been super fascinating as men we really appreciate you coming on and talking to us,
but it does happen again we've used up all that a lot of time so blisters want to continue the conversation we encourage you to jump over to our Facebook page and if you enjoy Today Show please jump on the iTunes give us that 5-star review and then you can download,
tophatter from there.

Scot:
[43:53] Yeah and obviously people should go in and try the platform do you do you publish stuff online where can people find you online if they're interested in learning more.

Ashvin:
[44:01] Yeah you can that you can find us on our Facebook page fault on Twitter.
Where are we have a were active on medium so we're publishing content everywhere we're also we're also watching it national TV campaign also so we're about to roll out a pretty big TV ad campaigns of silver,
TV channel near you too.

Scot:
[44:21] Congrats I'll be fun I look forward to.

Jason:
[44:23] Going to star in the first.

Ashvin:
[44:25] Yes absolutely.

Scot:
[44:27] Just can you give listeners a little preview of a little little sneak peek.

Ashvin:
[44:33] Yeah I think the world were appealing to the folks that want to have a fun experience shopping and so.

Scot:
[44:41] Awesome watching NBA jerseys.

Ashvin:
[44:43] Not yet.

Scot:
[44:44] Okay well we really appreciate you joining us I know you've been really busy here at the show out recruiting sellers for the platform so we really appreciate take your time.

Ashvin:
[44:53] Thank you Jason thanks God.

Jason:
[44:55] Until next time happy Commercing.

Apr 16, 2018

Episode 127 is an interview with Katya Ermak, Director of E-Commerce and Digital Marketing at Sabon NYC.   We caught up with Katya Ermak at the ShopTalk 2018. Katya is the director of E-commerce at Sabon NYC.  We talked with her about how Vertically integrated brands think of Amazon.  How they leverage their omni-channel tactics and the future of malls.  How Sabon is approaching e-commerce including their Magento platform, and some of their current tools such as Dynamic Yield.

Episode 127 of the Jason & Scot show was recorded on Monday, March 19, 2018.

New beta feature, Google Transcription:

Transcript

 Jason: 
[0:25] Welcome to the Jason and Scott show this episode is being recorded on Monday March 19th 2018 I'm your host Jason retailgeek Goldberg and as usual I'm here with your Wingo.

Scot: 
[0:38] Hey Jason welcome back Jason Scott show listeners we are podcasting live from the shock talk show here in sunny Las Vegas and we're excited to have on the show today Katja or Mac.
Katya is director of e-commerce and digital marketing at sabon NYC she has also spent time with Brands such as rainbow Century 21 and isobar welcome to the show.

Jason: 
[1:02] Thanks for joining us it's a little known fact but Scott exclusive.

Scot: 
[1:06] Did we use it as your.

Jason: 
[1:07] FedEx in his own bath so.

Katya: 
[1:09] That's great to hear.

Scot: 
[1:11] Yeah I'm going to have the bath bombs.

Jason: 
[1:13] So he's very excited about having you here when the things we always like to do on the show is talk to her guest.

Scot: 
[1:20] About their backgrounds and how they came to the control so could you.

Jason: 
[1:20] And how they came to their current role so could you tell us a little bit about as you got into the industry and and what your current role is.

Katya: 
[1:28] Wright's Okerlund director of e-commerce and just the market at sabon started there about.
Two and a half years ago before that I decided I was with isobars.
Worked on their engagement seem he ran out of states and before that I did a Content management for Rainbow shops.

[1:51] E-commerce was definitely something that,
I was interested in when I was in college I have a fashion business degree and I was just thinking of where can I go with that degrade dad would make the most value out of my account.
And I got a couple and their shapes e-commerce internship especially one with Century 21 which really to cough.
And I love my job love what I do eCommerce is fantastic and it's such a growing animal and there's so many different things that you can do with us.

Scot: 
[2:26] Did you go to the fitt isn't that the big fashion School in New York.

Katya: 
[2:30] Right now I went to Berkeley College which is Elsa in New York.

Scot: 
[2:33] Okay cool awesome yeah I mean a lot of young ladies that are studying fashion and there's a lot of different ways it go to nursing you chose e-commerce you feel like it's still scratches your fashion itch or.

Katya: 
[2:44] Absolutely that was like a business degree with a fashion flavor to it and as a side like.
I was interested to see I came to the Barclay because I wanted to be a buyer but while I'm studying there was.
Digital start taking off at that time and people start talking more and more about it and how did brick-and-mortar it will be going away and at some point it was very scary for fashion students because there was not a lot of job available and them.
I was looking for something that's going to be very up and come in and which I think I did a very right turn.

Scot: 
[3:24] Do they have chai have classes on how to do some digital marketing in that kind of thing or did you have to come pick it up on your own.

Katya: 
[3:30] Pick it up on my own I think we had maybe social media class or something like that.

Jason: 
[3:38] And can you tell us a little bit about like what the scope of your role is now so are you you responsible for operating the website and digital marketing.

Scot: 
[3:44] Responsible for operating the website and digital marketing and.

Katya: 
[3:49] The right I usually have I go about this the question like that as Dad to company currently has three ways of doing business so we have brick-and-mortar stores and in New York and we have wholesale Channel and we help outside so.
Each channel is has its own Department.
So my department and I'm head of the eCommerce department is responsible of running the website all the maintenance all the development all the digital marketing aspects.
Currently we doing things with be social with Google with your panel ads what do Google shopping ads email marketing.
Merchandising of the website the only thing that I'm not touching bases inventory and their warehouse relationship.

Jason: 
[4:39] Can you tell us a little bit about subbing for our Wizards I might not know I think of you is a vertically integrated brands.

Scot: 
[4:43] Think of you vertically integrated Brandt to you you guys make your own.

Jason: 
[4:47] Products in you sell them direct as well as through wholesale channels is that right or.

Katya: 
[4:52] Sabon at the bath and body products to reproduce by describes different moisturizing moisturizing lotions where electro brand,
originally we're from Israel.
So our products and natural in the based on that sea salts and minerals and that seemed muds original or the company was billed as the,
franchise which country was its own franchise had at the store it's only Commerce about a year-and-a-half ago we got bought out by grouper shop.
And older franchises for kind of put together and now we're. Like its own company we.
Getting our products from Israel from our Global office and then we end up here you missed it then floss with your wholesale as well.

Jason: 
[5:46] Got you and you have a number of stores as well.

Katya: 
[5:49] So in New York with have down stores.
Which primarily in the Hat and one in Brooklyn One Long Island around the world we have about I want to stay 200 stores.
I'm waiting when country is when France England New Orleans Japan Korea.

Jason: 
[6:12] Don't you very cool that's one of the questions I'm always interested in when there's a brand selling online that also own stores.
Is some of the omni-channel aspects but you know so like.

[6:27] Any attribution and figure out how the website is potentially driving people to your store or any any sort of digital experiences in the store those sorts of things.

Katya: 
[6:39] It's always has been an ongoing chat challenge for us.
Because the company was a franchise so originally it was just about driving Revenue we didn't talk about how,
what the customer experiences are what are they experiencing the stores,
with the expansion of Commerce and how it's all blending together how we can drive traffic for both and support each other so.
This is currently changing and though we talked with talking about it was talking about different experiences that we can create one of the projects the wave.
Working on right now is offer and we start War friends.
So glad classes and understand our stores and just set it up like serve booking and the schedule and through the website,
set of creating the tide out therapy, the experience with,
tile store experiences but it's an ongoing challenge will always talk about it right now and will always thinking of how can we restore the very beautiful and we have this personal experiences when you get.
Hand treatment there is a big whale when you can start a product if people owe people doesn't know customer doesn't know our brand and they're the coming to the website that getting.
Very slightly different experience rather than to the store so it's always a conversation how do we get that will experience the very personal that spends on the website and.
It's an ongoing conversation ongoing challenge for us which I'm hoping to grab more answers on the shop.

Scot: 
[8:15] It would be a Jason Scott show if we didn't talk a little bit about Amazon and you talked about wholesale is Amazon so when you guys wholesale with and how would you describe your your kind of Amazon strategy and I'm thinking around them is up,
partner slash competitors which is always a very much a friend of me with for everybody.

Katya: 
[8:34] So that the company has a partnership at wholesale partnership with Amazon I think it was started about 3 year 3 years ago it took off and.
Brought us Revenue brought us some sales and brought the brand recognition but we experience on the challenge of that it's very hard for us to manage and change the prices and change.
Kind of given that experience that we have.
On our Ecommerce outside or in the stores so with that being said but decided to launch Amazon is a Marketplace.
With a felon buy on Amazon and we.
Got a partner Channel advisor which is helping us kind of guiding us through and helping us set it up that channel is currently rolling out so I think we should be good to go I started selling there in about couple weeks.

Scot: 
[9:26] Thanks for being a great that and then are you guys going to do hybrid we still do some wholesale and some third-party.

Katya: 
[9:35] So we think when we going to go out there Amazon Marketplace looking to see what's out of traction and we getting it sad is going to be different products.
That wholesale had done from with Amazon Marketplace we're going to be doing and we'll see how it's going to go if it's going to be,
very successful we're going to slowly over allowed their wholesale piece off the table or,
maybe it's going to be a bad idea to keep them in a conjunction working so it depends like really wanted to see and learn first to make it in time decisions.

Scot: 
[10:07] Brickell conditioner at the path to purchase showing you had to head out and I wouldn't get a chance to talk about it but I'm in the queue today it was interesting,
as Brands brought up to the challenges with with Amazon more and more of them were being sought for this hybrid model so for example one brand was complaining Amazon wouldn't order their product fast enough and one of the panelists,
because most actually recommended you know you can actually have your you could you can you do Marketplace for that same item and then if Amazon sales your item,
you can at least have some guarantee that your product will be there there some other examples like that were in the early days of hybrid it was just selection you know Amazon has ex and I want them to have x + y and now there's like some more advanced strategies there for.

Katya: 
[10:48] Marriage Style.

Jason: 
[10:52] What are things that was interesting to me about any on the show is that I have this right you were one.

Scot: 
[10:58] Very early.

Jason: 
[10:59] Hours of dynamic yield.
Is a software tool for doing personalization based on some some AI deep learning your chop talk those are the big buzzwords is personalization and Nai in so I was I was just curious.

Scot: 
[11:10] I was just curious what kind of experiences you were you were in able.

Jason: 
[11:19] You are enabling for your Shoppers with Dynamic yield and is it just email is it on your site and.

Katya: 
[11:27] Sabon was the very early adopter robbed and I make you up and it just started out.
And Esteban will love Dynamic yield and we pretty much do everything with them. Potentially.
Did done utilizing their platform we just roll out and I think in August.
Product recommendation on our homepage on the mobile on our product pages on in the car.

[11:59] We also serve banners all over Bennett's in the website was served through the night make you all them would do it be testing reason Infinity.
And we starting up looking about 30% of them would just roll them out in conversion rate and customer satisfaction.

[12:22] I think there's so many things that you can do is then I make your old and strategies that we can Implement and you see it like I constantly seeing their case study that they're releasing or how they communicate with their how they work.
There are other clients on the smaller scale of what the what weekend do mechanics executor so many things.
Execution part where smallest unit sabon so it's a little bit harder.
I think they doing an event in April in New York and it's going to be talking about more proficiency how different strategies for product personalization.
We started with the product personalization on a homepage was started with a B test and soda personalized ended by customer who did its website and then we'll switch they were committed the resistance in today.
Animation that learning in the recommended products that way and we'll see.
Tremendous increases and sales in conversion other things in there and Genesis.
So interesting and it's.
Why don't those things that blowing my mind do you put in a smoke JavaScript X all on your website and you can.
Change in the real time you can you can test,
different with the with Dustin different pages would destined for muscle ache if you have how many different fields you can have and which one converts bad or so before before releasing anything pretty much on the website experience-wise for.

[13:54] Customers were always faster always create 3/4 in Arizona with Dustin which one performs better same goes for all of our batteries all the copy that would do for the.
Banners and difficult to actions and different images and different backgrounds and it's open it up so.

[14:14] It's open. So many opportunities to learn who your customers and what they like and kind of a learning curve you constantly it's not it's not a platform that you just kind of.
Started doing the things for you to constantly need to learn.
Your phone those tests but it's open it up in a big door in personalization and making you a customer experience very personal for them.

Scot: 
[14:39] I'm not a personalization experts maybe you guys can answer this so so does it kind of learn,
okay this particular customer loves the flavian of the lavender or something then it'll show them more of that kind of thing I know it sounds like you got some maybe optimization kind of testing stuff,
but then the personalization does it kind of like learn what people like and then it changes the website based on those earnings.

Katya: 
[15:01] Right so it's obviously a quickie that every single person who comes in they said they cook it and we can sell what.
What Journey did they had enough said what kind of batter the cloak on,
what kind of products they looked at since they looked at the exfoliating products are monosaccharides and products,
did they make a purchase at the after the cards post was there about cars value in Basin that information.
The next time to come back we're going to serve them a different experience which could be anything we can recover the products if they were added something to the car is that the dead purchase.
And then they come back maybe it will show them that product with the potential deal that they can get for that or if they weren't.
Product page and then the added something else of the cards will show them assume all products in the car this wall there's a lot of different scenarios they can think about is how to personalize.

Scot: 
[15:59] This is some married to Magento or is it a it's at Works within him.

Jason: 
[16:03] That's a space tool you can Implement in NY Bridal platforms I think you guys impact are running it on Magento though what's was cool to me.

Scot: 
[16:13] We had personalization for a long time.

Jason: 
[16:17] What are the better you get to know the.

Scot: 
[16:18] Where the better you get to know the customer over multiple sessions you you can stay.

Jason: 
[16:22] D'Amore.

Scot: 
[16:24] I've been to that customer in that that's still really important.

Jason: 
[16:27] I still really important for monocytes though the majority of visitors are first-time visitors and so.

Scot: 
[16:33] So where a lot of personalization is a Scorpion falling down.

Jason: 
[16:35] Falling Down is.

Scot: 
[16:39] Every customer is unknown so they get the same generic experience and.

Jason: 
[16:40] So they get the same generic experience and you know you.

Scot: 
[16:43] Come back over and over again get this great personalized.

Jason: 
[16:45] But they are small percentage of the.

Scot: 
[16:46] Small percentage of the total traffic better now is what I'll call.
Incontact in session personalization where they like in Forever explicit and implicit signals.

Jason: 
[16:54] Concession personalization where they like in fur explicit and implicit signals from.

Scot: 
[17:02] The browsing you're doing in the single session.

Jason: 
[17:04] 10 + *.

Scot: 
[17:05] Dynamically personalizing for those unknown first-time visitor.

Katya: 
[17:09] Describe Viking Camper for I'm sort of some sort of actually writing this scenario would the customer perform some sort of action like this subscribe to newsletter click to the body scrub at it since the car we're going to start time at the front experience based on what they see in.

Scot: 
[17:23] Do you start to so sounds like it'll also work with display ads which is cool how about like your email marketing Ken can I personalize your email marketing so you know some lady likes a certain sent you can send her,
Fort Worth jet something in her cart watch pie easy with cart abandonment emails but any personalization keep personalized like the emails you send out to.

Katya: 
[17:42] Within Emma Guild you can upload the back so that we can put their dinner,
your vagina inside of your email and you can serve them to like you have your content of the email like a promotion your content and down on the bottom you can show.
Products specific was looking for that customer.

Scot: 
[18:03] That's the first way that these.

Jason: 
[18:06] This way that these tools.

[18:10] Well then it is for the whole platforms of.

Scot: 
[18:12] In the cool new feature that these guys are all.

Jason: 
[18:16] Starting to roll out now is personalization.

Scot: 
[18:17] Right now is personalization at open.

Jason: 
[18:21] You can imagine like you send.

Scot: 
[18:23] Email and if you have some personalized content in there it may be.

Jason: 
[18:25] Personalize content in there that maybe is.

Scot: 
[18:30] Has been personalized to the weather or something you buy.

Jason: 
[18:31] Whether or something you browse for.

Katya: 
[18:33] Based on time,
for example if if we're running a promotion or some sort of dro sale so while the promotion promotion is running you going to see a clock down so you open,
you open up your email and see if you can see it back down that says like,
this promotion going to add in one hour if you open it at 30 minutes is going to say the promotions going to end 30 minutes and when the promotion ends in from simple to say I miss that and I open it up email after a week is going to show me something.

Scot: 
[19:01] Buckeye Jail.

Jason: 
[19:05] And its tail when the person oppa.

Scot: 
[19:07] Awesome so it sounds like you have a relatively small e-commerce operation guys are dog doing a lot of pretty cutting-edge things what was kind of next on the road map where do you see e-commerce going.
I with you guys then we'll talk Bradley about where your overall you so you can respond.

Katya: 
[19:23] So another says so I was talking about.
Sorry about that was talking about experiences Brandon to gather their stores and online we're working for another big project for us is the CRM.
And we have a little to program and how how do we.
Like the date of the week coming from magenta from our e-commerce platform is very clean the date of that we getting for people who signed out in the stores for loyalty program is not that clean so right now we're working on how do we combine,
dos2 Joseph data points and create that.
Loyalty emails and loyalty programs campaign so we talked with our loyal to customers at the same.
But you can start at them the same it doesn't matter where they shop and where they saying up because we don't know but we think there is a lot of Gap and there's a lot of them.
Cross reference of the people shopping at the shop in the stores and the shop online I feel like it's Crossing each other this year,
we talkin in the company lied about CRM and loyalty and how do we bring this together what kind of campaigns were created and what kind of software we using one of their things why we came to the shop talk and like they do is mine,
what is to find a CRM solution that we can use all of the data sort of segments that other than Kinect.

Jason: 
[20:54] Very cool and there are several of them there so I suspect you'll you'll be successful in that mission you mentioned loyalty programs and that's been interesting to me cuz.

Scot: 
[21:00] You mentioned loyalty programs and that's been interesting to me cuz that.

Jason: 
[21:04] Feels a little bit like one of the themes of this year's show in.

Scot: 
[21:08] Ulta Keynotes.

Jason: 
[21:08] Ulta keynote they they mention that like the wealthy members represented something I want to say 90 or 95% of their total revenue which is.

Scot: 
[21:20] I mean astronomical the Nike Chief digital officer talked about.

Jason: 
[21:21] Michael the Nike Chief digital officer talked about how how successful their their Nike Plus loyalty program had been.

Scot: 
[21:28] Nike Plus royalty program it been it sounds like you've had a loyalty.

Jason: 
[21:33] You had a loyalty program for a while is it like a straight points for purchase program or how does it work.

Katya: 
[21:39] So
Historical we had to separate program Swan was the e-commerce little to program when you collect points for every purchase to do you make and then you released and then you redeem it for purchase online and we had a loyalty program in the stores.
I'd same idea it was a little bit different so e-commerce it was once a once-a-month going on dollar stores with tiered I think it was five tiers,
so this summer when we just launched the new upside in August and will I see the new pair of system in July.
2027 able to pick you up for a lot of different changes and we'll launch our new loyalty program the idea was this to combine their loyalty program in the stores and and online,
kind of make it more sing with experience so it's currently is the same program you Wednesday for every dollar you spend.
And then you can redeem at there's no cap and Redemption you also is a part of the Lord's apart of me also get welcome coupons and will be found as Dad.
There's two coupons when is set up but you can use the next month.
And the next next month so that's something that we actually got from overcome our parent company in Israel this is how they do it and they saw a lot more traction with just given a 10% sign up coupon,
people people people coming back to redeem it more often and it works pretty well for us but we have a birthday.

[23:17] Coupon that we said that the birthday gift that was on for the people to read them during their birthday month.
And will do a lot of activities for our world passport will call them roll past board members would do events in the stores where are we.
Do different treatments or different parties and we have I would do like new collection previews for them.
It's another big thing that would Jordan like one of them stuck in before about CRM and how do we connect them it's still a little bit separated in terms of the promotions and like.
I feel like in the store part would do much better much better job for the Loyalty rather than on the website so we talkin about how we can come by and make that experience more seamless.

Jason: 
[24:04] Since you mentioned that you were going to look for some CRM Solutions it shoptalk we're sort of one day another show a day and a half in the show.
Have you seen anything or or setting on a sessions that would be interesting to you.

Katya: 
[24:20] Not yet.

Scot: 
[24:23] Did she the Ulta keynote the kind of edger talk about experiences in a store,
she's saying they're going to add a lot more experience than I already have like a salon in the story but I think they're going to add you almost more like taking it to a spa level of so it's kind of reminds me of some of the things you talked about that you guys doing your store I don't know if you saw it or not.

Katya: 
[24:39] I saw something the Sephora was talking about it and they were showing all this experience as they did they create it's for their Shopper and this is it was very inspiring conversation the presentation that she had.
She was talking about all of this this is exactly what we're looking for and I think that's exactly what the industry needs and like,
the eve what the economist is moving Taurus is to like for example somebody get a notification that they forgot things in their cards and they're walking by the Sea for the,
that they put a sample in there Carlin Dave it's there so this is why I would email them or send them a notification from there uh.
Dad there's a store and the samples of all been there so you can come and pick it up.
And you're passing by the store you come over talking to the sale associate to give any of that sample while they're doing that the same oh we also do all this experience is in the store treatments would you like to set up this and you know.
Right there and then they perform the treatment on you and all the product of what he's doing the truth then you will receive the samples and then to send you an e-mail.
Where is all this products and how do use them and the price point so then you can come back and either purchase them in the app.
In the under your desktop in the Commerce website or you can come back back to the store to the store so I feel like they're doing great job in tiny tiny and those experiences in this something that.
I really wanted some time and think about it if so I'll come back from the shop.

Scot: 
[26:14] You kicked off what kind of Go full circle you talk about when you started your career,
you were at heard in the stores are closing you want to get me Commerce how do you feel about stores now, they've been in the industry for a while if you think you think the small again and Retail apocalypse thing is over done or do you think it is tough for store what's the future stores.

Katya: 
[26:32] It's interesting that's what the a lot of feel like a lot of things on top soccer talking about exactly like is the freaking word dad or.
As odd involving the different way I personally think and a lot of people in the industry as wild that.
Brick-and-mortar is not that bad but there was people who doing a ride and people who are not quite there yet and depending on how fast they can get there.
What could it mean if they're going to keep their stores or not people definitely looking for some personalized experience as what we can do in a store to make it more relevant the more exciting.
What are those experiences and I feel like this is where the industry going.

[27:14] And I feel like they're at the seam of everything that I said today is about those experiences like what can we make so exciting for the customer.
For them to come back obviously they're interacting with their sales associate interacting with the product when you see can't touch them smell them it's so much different from you, so I feel like.
There's the stores going to definitely stay there not going anywhere but it's going to be involved into something completely different then we'll just have to buckle up.
The bump it right and see where it takes us.

Scot: 
[27:48] Buckle up buttercup a perfect.

Jason: 
[27:51] Place to end it because it has happened again we've used up all our a lot of.

Scot: 
[27:56] The time.

Jason: 
[27:57] But we certainly want to thank you for.

Scot: 
[27:58] I want to thank you for taking time off.

Jason: 
[28:01] Join us.

Scot: 
[28:02] Other folks have questions you're welcome to jump on a.

Jason: 
[28:03] Questions are welcome to jump on the Facebook and continue the conversation there is always if you enjoy Today Show we'd love it if you jump on the iTunes and give us that 5-star review and until you do that we will be buckled up here.

Scot: 
[28:17] Thanks Ryan Scott you're really appreciate you taking time.

Jason: 
[28:21] Until next time happy commercing.

Apr 9, 2018

EP126 - American Eagle former CDO Joe Megibow

We caught up with Joe Megibow at the RetailNext party at ShopTalk this year. Joe is the former chief digital officer at American Eagle Outfitters, he's also served as President at Joyous.com and General Manager for Expedia.com.  We talked with Joe about his impression of ShopTalk this year, his early experiences in the e-commerce industry (including at TeaLeaf which was acquired by IBM), how American Eagle thinks about Omni-Channel.

About RetailNext Conference:

Retailers and brands at scale can apply for a complimentary pass for the CommerceNext conference - The Summit for Next Level Customer Acquisition - Jul 25/26 2018 NYC.  This show is a combination of strategic keynotes from the likes of (Amit Shah – CMO 1800flowers; Sid Jatia – VP, Global Commerce at Under Armour; Charlie Cole, Global Chief Ecommerce Officer and Chief Digital Officer, Samsonite/TUMI, etc.); and tactical ‘how-to’ speakers like Amy Africa (CEO, Eight by Eight) and Facebook expert Emily Hickey.

Announcing the CommerceNext "Nexty's": A new peer-reviewed award program identifying and rewarding the best marketing performances among retail and eCommerce professionals. Awards include “Marketing Innovator of the Year” and “Highest ROI with the Least Resources”. Visit commercenext.com to nominate a fellow retailer for an award and to apply for your free conference pass.

Episode 126 of the Jason & Scot show was recorded on Monday, March 19, 2018.

http://jasonandscot.com

Join your hosts Jason "Retailgeek" Goldberg, SVP Commerce & Content at SapientRazorfish, and Scot Wingo, Founder and Executive Chairman of Channel Advisor as they discuss the latest news and trends in the world of e-commerce and digital shopper marketing.

New beta feature, Google Transcription:

Transcript

Jason: 
[0:25] Welcome to the Jason and Scott show this episode is being recorded on Monday March 19th 2018 I'm your host Jason retailgeek Goldberg and as usual I'm here with your Scott Wingo.

Scot: 
[0:39] Hey Jason I'm walking back Jason Scott show listeners we are here live from the shop talk show in Las Vegas and are one of the hottest parties at shop.
Scott Silverman in Allen Dick's Commerce next party this party is a who's who of the digital Commerce crowd.
A couple of housekeeping things before we jump into a visit with one of our guest here who we plucked out of the party so.
Little thank you for the folks at Commerce Max they wanted to let you know that retailers and brands that scale can apply for a complimentary pass for the Commerce next conference.
That's going to be the summit for Next Level customer acquisition held July 25th and 26th in New York City.
The shows a combination of strategic Keynotes from the lights of 1-800 Flowers and Under Armour and then also tactical information from Amy Africa and Facebook.
Facebook expert Emily hickey there also starting something called the next these which is a peer-reviewed award program if you're interested in learning more about that go to Commerce next.com.
Jason were excited to have on the show Joe megibow Joe has had a story 20 year history and Retail and e-commerce including on the retail side American Eagle Outfitters Expedia and hotels.com.
Then he has been on the vendor side like you and I are today over a tea leaf IBM and is currently operations advisor with Advent International that's a private Equity Firm that has a portfolio of retailers including Lululemon welcome to the show Joe.

Joe: 
[2:04] Thank you I appreciate you plucking me out of the party.

Jason: 
[2:07] We were thrilled to get you.

[2:10] Usually we start at the show by kind of getting a quick rundown on guest background and how you came into the e-commerce industry in your case this could be the start of a long answer.

Joe: 
[2:24] Okay I'll try not to make it too long.
I've been in been in the internet or really webspace since since it began actually started as a.
Engineer so I I find some of us in e-commerce based came up from war of the traditional retail merchandising route others came up the technical route II came up the technical route.
And I was in the web early days good friend of mine and I worked in a Advanced Technology Group for a manufacturer actually in Upstate New York.
And those days we we still coming to work every day with one question we asked each other.
Have you found any new websites because we've been to all of them.
And wished we literally had a noun or a little modems at the time hitting the early days of the web so I.
Yeah I've been fighting the fight on trying to educate companies and organizations on what this thing is about and how to how to embrace it as something other than a sideshow novelty since since it began.

[3:27] But I am.
Ended up in management consulting for number years help launching e-commerce practice for one of the big Big 5 consulting firms ended up at interesting little start up a company called Tea Leaf technology.
Tea Leaf back in the day was way ahead of its time but we we realized early on that just basic.
Numerical tracking of what pages you had been on what was often called his web logs just wasn't enough for a truly understanding.
The ladies are experience a customer experience and we had come up with some novel technology to allow you to see everything that was happening with the customer and it in retail it's not that different than say.
Going into the store and Walking the Floor something any good retail executive does they go in and watch the customers and see what's going on and see what's working and what's not and speak with them.
And there really wasn't an analog for that online so we we built some initial technology to do that.
For me personally what was amazing about it is 4 years working with hundreds of a transactional companies.
I got kind of a front row seat on seeing what really work.
And what really didn't whether we're talk to human factors human psychology understanding why is it that.
So many websites at the time just kind of shocked and head was just really hard to get things done friction issues getting in the way that's a lot of the stuff was built by engineer is not.
By people who understand human so I did that for a lot of years ended up an Expedia for 6 years running a number of things ultimately running the expedia.com us business.

[5:02] American Eagle Outfitters for 3 years running digital there really at their transition tree. Of being.
A great brick-and-mortar store but understanding not only getting e-commerce right but truly leaning into an Amish handle experience should I happy to chat with you guys about and.
Stood up for about a year did an interesting start up with a joyous a video based e-commerce retailer and what I loved about that was the focus was bringing the Humanity online just how do you control a.
Help understand what makes a product great outside of the traditional just grid and content view of a products which we ended up.
Selling the company hand doing advising and Consulting now.

Jason: 
[5:45] That's awesome nice concise recap of an amazingly Rich career.

[5:54] TV this is super exciting to me cuz for the Wizards.
I'm familiar it was a real game-changer like I sent you yet records sessions so that site team can watch Shopper behavior for.

[6:09] Learning about conversion optimization and an opportunity to improve things and also for troubleshooting problems so before that like.

[6:17] Your sales would be way down on a promotion day and you really had no way to know if you look at the metrics and see that nothing converted but you really have no I didn't see that like.

[6:27] You are losing customers at this form or at the.

Joe: 
[6:30] Yeah we and it was interesting we,
like I stumbled onto some insights just again trying to figure out why did conversion not hit the numbers we wanted like one of the early observations we had we ended up creating a kpi around this week all the PSR purchase success rate.
And it turned out we were looking at this was in my in my travel days but it's it works in in retail as well.
We knew what the fall off was on the traditional funnel I mean when you attack of conversion rate in the in the funnel.
We knew that they were getting to the last step in the process but the Fallout you expect if someone's going all the way through the checkout process that you have a very high percentage of people who then complete the transaction and it was it was not it the high-percentage we thought.
So why are people dropping out and with no one had figured out at the time and what we stumbled into by looking at this more complete view of the data is a ton of people were in fact trying to.
We just weren't letting them and whether it would means that the transaction was failing.
It was for a whole lot of reasons account failure where the credit card not being processed or incorrect information on doing the verification on the credit card and it needed you know somewhere between 1 and 5 + 1 + 4.
20 and 25% of the people may think about this you walked into a store you browse around you found something you want to buy.
You've actually gone through the process you gone up to the POS you've gone through this and I'm online it's much more challenging.

[8:00] My home address and my information my credit how you typed all this and you've actually clicked the button complete transaction the please take my money I want to do business with you.
And the response was no you no soup for you tonight and it's it's it's crazy in the end the.
Recovery rate on this was very low as well and you don't step 1 and in fixing things is acknowledging the problem and we were measuring the wrong thing we didn't even realize that was a failure to measure and.
Yeah we've we turned out you never get to 100% purchase success rate some people always have credit to clients.
But the ideas how do you actually look at that make sure anyone who should be complaining a transaction.
Let him complete it and get that up to the high 9 days which took months of work to fix but no one again it's like turning a light on in a closet it's been dark with never even seen that.

Scot: 
[8:52] Then I'll wear your Expedia when they were part of interactive Corp or was this.

Joe: 
[8:56] This was shortly after I see spun out all the the travel properties which was a collection at the time of Expedia hotels.com Hotwire TripAdvisor,
since I laughed the acquired orbits Travelocity and then the number of the other players.

Scot: 
[9:13] Some ways to travel world even then but even today was kind of a couple Generations ahead of us and e-commerce World about.
Current traffic monetizing it always amazes me how they're they're totally friendly with each other and always routing traffic through each other in a much different world than we would it and e-commerce.
You'll see Amazon cycle traffic over to Walmart or something like that.

Joe: 
[9:33] I know and I think that's actually how I ended up in retail is.
One thing about travel for sure it's a great experiences and it's not about the transaction I mean it's ultimately about the trip and the places you're going and,
I I think some of the players are realizing what I think travel is crossed over into retail lives that yet travel was.
It from A disruption standpoint 10 years ahead of retail but was still deeply consumer-focused.
What was interesting to me going from travel to retailer really from Marketplace two or more vertically two-player as a lot of the tricks that I expected would work didn't work at all in retail.
And it was some some fascinating learning so you one example is the funnel.
I'm in bed the oldest trick in the book if you want to like make them more quickly it started the bottom of the funnel and start working up and find the people who are the most qualified most committed and what's not working find that friction rooted and it's free money.
And in a fashion apparel retailer American Eagle didn't work.
I am going I mean he joined a new company and you pull out your playbook that always works and it doesn't work it's sort of this oh crap moment of what have I gotten myself into.
And the internet turned out in a in a fashion business it's an upside-down funnel.
The consideration where they fall out is at the top of the funnel it's discretionary spend I'm trying to decide.

[11:04] I need a new pair of pants I need a new top what am I going to buy at you you hope you have loyal fashion brand followers.
The reality is even your most loyal customers still don't exclusively shop with you so when you're in that consideration said you're at the top of the funnel.
They're deciding hey what's new with trash was out there that's when the Fallout occurs by the time they're at the last step of check out.
Big decided I'm giving you my money this is the the transaction I want it if it doesn't work it turns out though actually that is a different elasticity will try again or go to the store.
The call the call center there's a much higher probability you'll get this a lot but then the flipside happens which is at the top of the funnel.
If you are not getting a ride especially if your vertical integrated if you're the only place where can I buy the product that's where it really matters and we ended up switching everything around and then how do we make sure we're educating on the brain.
I can give you the right information without relying and Associates in stores because that's where the Fallout was occurring fascinating difference.

Scot: 
[12:09] Search more detailed product pages more serendipitous Discovery stuck at the top tell people at self-educate.

Joe: 
[12:16] Yeah I hardly I am I looked the stores a lot for inspiration and it's kind of a digital guy I think it's easy to fall into hey we don't need stores or.
But there's a lot about stores that work really really well and have for decades that I have yet to see online replicate.

Scot: 
[12:33] The bigger shopping cart.

Joe: 
[12:35] Other interesting Lee there I was fascinated when I joined that but a lot of the apparel companies use the notion bag and not shopping cart and I was frustrated by this.
I actually sat down to prove that we were getting a wrong and then I discovered every apparel company use bag which.
I think it's all just a bunch of silliness it doesn't really matter but but if you walk into a retail store.
There are people there there are Associates their customers and you get a vibe from this within seconds you know if you walk into a restaurant or store if you're in the right place how hit me up if you're a straight-laced person and you walked in and saw a bunch of.
Bikers wearing leather and whatever you feel like this is not my scene where you walk into a place that supposedly popular and it's empty.
And you see this what are people shopping what are they buying what are the associates doing how are they engaging is it is it a heavy cell is an inclusive is an exclusive and you pick this up almost free.
Online it's kind of like saying find me my flagship store.
Perfect inventory position perfectly assorted perfect graphics and displays but you walk in at 2 a.m. on a Sunday when nobody's there you're on your own.
And that's that's most shopping online and this is a huge gap and helping people discover and the Serendipity of shopping this is just not been figured out.

Jason: 
[14:02] Said you feel like you have you run into any tactics that you think partly address that cuz it's.

Joe: 
[14:07] For sure I think and it's all just little Windows into the human psychology to try to solve these things and then sometimes it can be a very subtle ways one of the biggest lips we got back of my travel days.
Wait we called it a sense of urgency messaging but the idea was you're not allowed in part of the inside came from the number one call to the call center.
Was a simple question that needed to be answered was just is this hotel room going to be okay just it's a big expense it's going to be a bad Hotel it's kind of ruins your vacation.
And we we put these little pop ups on the screen which were just 10 people are viewing this hotel right now.
15 people have booked this hotel in the last 24 hours the last hour.

Scot: 
[14:50] One room left.

Joe: 
[14:51] One room left which is sense of urgency but one more popular people are here right now and it was just anything to give that same replication of that store experience.
It's popular you walk into a store and there's a popular item on the ground or at the front door on display and there's only one left in your size and your smile what do you do.
You grabbed it off the rack and you hold it you may not buy it but it is my option to choose I'm going to hang on to this thing until I decide I don't want it so how do you create that same sense.
Requires being there and seeing other people around and knowing the scarcity of the item how do you create that same sense online send me that just one example of like a digital proxy for creating that that we've done.

Jason: 
[15:34] Yeah it is interesting I call that the sort of first Shopper problem cuz everyone that comes with e-commerce side feels like the first shopper.

[15:42] It's ever been on that site like there's your point there's no footsteps of those previous customers.
I started my career in brick-and-mortar retail and I was looking up to work with this legendary visual Merchant this guy named Joe was sheer and he used to.

[15:59] Do the most amazing product displays all would like way higher conversion than any of his peers.

[16:07] And the coolest thing he ever taught me is like you do this beautiful visual display and then the last thing you do before you open the store.
Is you randomly take three scuse off that display.

[16:19] Cuz no one wants to walk in and buy you know how to take that first SKU out the pyramid and feel like they're the first one to make this risky purchase they want to feel like.

[16:28] Man that was just a customer here ahead of me and grabbed it.

[16:33] There's this they're out of business now on Saturday but that jackthreads these type of my favorite features that used to.

[16:40] Expose their there like high-level analytics on the product detail pages so I can you could literally see like five thousand people looked at these trousers and a thousand of them.

Joe: 
[16:53] I ate an educated just trying to replicate I eat you talk about product displays I think another interesting test we did that worked out rather well so we.
Is there very tight control especially from the merchants in the product owners on how you display product online.
Yummy you want this to be the best presentation of the product and lizards lay down or lifestyle shots are on body but how do you really bring this product life and make it be true to the Brandon to the product.
The challenges it's in at 8 that off in 3 aspirational it's reaching people want to know how's it going to be.
I need a store again you get that for free because other people are in the store wearing the product whether it's real humans were Associates or whether it's other customers you can get a sense of how the product.
So am I in where you often have is your social feeds that you're getting photos posted Instagram information based marketing.
Tag my brand include me in the conversation get it up there but this stuff is off and relegated to a blog or style board or somewhere off on the side where if you true to be that brand customer to look it's interesting.
But it's very disjointed from the shopping experience so the idea was how could we make this part of the product experience twins on the product detail page not only do I see the grade.
Produce Merchant LED photography but let me see the real user photographs as well.
Which man tagging them flowing through so they came into the product detail page but it created tension inside of retailers because it now I'm giving up control on house.

[18:25] It's not you and not everyone do consumer truly represents that idealistic brand standard and and how do you reconcile that but what was interesting is.
It kind of credit just in these are my words become a book end.
Approachability you've got the very perfect on point brand beautiful people who show the product and the aspirational luck you know I want to look more like that.
But then you saw a real world people who showed you this was approachable achievable I can do that.
If they can wear that I can wear that I'm going to look good and enjoy giving it that grounding and they're the real you know that this is real people wearing real product alongside having sort of what the division of what you want to look like.
Turn up work really well and you know and then to change how we approach things and then the idea was truly let's get this real user.
On as many product pages as we could and do that in an automated systematic way but again to me it's just it's just tapping into that human psychology of bringing the real world experience.

Scot: 
[19:29] You guys were very early on mobile to because your audience being Millennials was like really pushing that are any interesting insights that you learned kind of.

Joe: 
[19:38] We we did a many many many and I've been I've been passion about mobile so I Expedia we had the first Transit.

[19:49] Psych on which we launched on the iPhone when it came out we had one of the first.

[19:56] Best for Bravada years.

[20:03] But I would have never guessed so we've got this at American Eagle we have an app it does pretty well it's it's our loyalty program.

Scot: 
[20:09] I need the address.

Joe: 
[20:11] Customers and Maya my head of mobile at the time who's been in the mobile space since since the old.
Days he he's hammering me for let's put radio in a rap music.

Scot: 
[20:24] What am I cramping.

Joe: 
[20:26] Brand experience.

Scot: 
[20:28] Stores.

Joe: 
[20:29] We had a partner who could be relatively low.
Classic basic.

[20:36] Free.

Scot: 
[20:37] A lot of my life playlist.

Joe: 
[20:41] It just didn't seem that important to me.
Finally thanks Jeremy he he just wore me down and he's like I got it I've actually already.

Scot: 
[20:49] Actually already done.

Joe: 
[20:52] Due diligence you just got to say yes and it's going to be.
Any apps and we put in a nap and some amazing things happen.

Scot: 
[21:01] Customer.

Joe: 
[21:07] They hated it but for reasons that were more comical to me they love the music as well and they said and they turned out they were good customers of ours,
and they using.
Like I can never leave this.

Jason: 
[21:20] Score now yeah.

Joe: 
[21:23] Store and I'm like oh that's that's actually when you know that's just kind of hidden in a complaint but he was the interesting thing when we started getting into the.
And we were very religious I'm looking.
At the metrics and how all the opolis Performing the uninstall rate.

Scot: 
[21:39] So we would look at my coworker.

Joe: 
[21:40] So we would look at my cohorts of 7 days out how many people still have the app installed dropped in half we had twice.

Scot: 
[21:47] Install.

Joe: 
[21:50] The average session duration everything we were saying massive Improvement which also meant are rank improved and in.
Because the number of downloads weren't changing and yeah there's always been sort of thoughts on hey is a.

Scot: 
[22:05] Engagement uninstall Ray.

Joe: 
[22:11] You're busy chat just it was a better app.

Scot: 
[22:13] And we were not only were born.

Joe: 
[22:20] Former warden in range and guess what rank is more download the engagement and there's a virtuous cycle there so yeah it's a stick.

Scot: 
[22:28] Traffic getting into tonight.

Joe: 
[22:31] Before and giving them what they need.

Scot: 
[22:34] We have some beginning marketers on the show talking about cohort analysis and I think that's an interesting topic and you probably have done enough of this year I have like your favorite view of that.
So maybe it's a pretend you're talking to someone that you know is just getting an e-commerce.
Somewhat technical on the marketing explain cowardin Alice's we can use the app. I know there's a lot of nice ones explain that and then maybe talk about some best practices using.

Joe: 
[22:58] Sure I may take it up a level I just say.

Scot: 
[23:01] How to say how do you say before eating.

Joe: 
[23:04] Analysis it means to have clean data to understand who my customer is and how can I start.

[23:11] It's a fancy way of just looking at groups of people and comparing them typically overtime so you can.

Scot: 
[23:15] So you can understand it's something worth.

Jason: 
[23:19] You can charge more for a cohort then you can for a.

Joe: 
[23:23] But I ate nothing scares me more than making really good decisions on bad data and I think part of the challenge and I think this is getting harder not easier is how do you actually.

[23:41] User Axe and I've got Bob or Susie out there and who is.

Scot: 
[23:44] Who is Bob Mackie what have they done so I can come over.

Joe: 
[23:51] In a world where.

Scot: 
[23:54] I got more people going.

Joe: 
[23:56] But still transacting a desktop may I mean think about this most people's mobile conversion of 1/2 to 1/4 of what their desktop site is and if I were.

Scot: 
[24:04] Basic now and oh by the way mobile sound 50% the majority of my business is going to be.

Joe: 
[24:13] A half or a quarter of my traditional business.

Scot: 
[24:17] My business.

Joe: 
[24:21] So there's a paradox here which is.

Scot: 
[24:23] I am I not getting my business completely call Omar.

Joe: 
[24:27] Where the basic metrics are true and really what it is.

Scot: 
[24:31] If people are coming your side 3 times.

Joe: 
[24:35] Purchase now they're going twice on mobile and once on desktop and oh by the way my desktop conversion you know which I attribute.

Scot: 
[24:42] So glad of that stalking her for not being able to.

Joe: 
[24:53] Because the way most of these.

Scot: 
[24:54] Looking.

Joe: 
[24:56] Where did I see you first and where the transaction occur and if you can't connect the dots and say hey I saw you on.

Scot: 
[25:00] Can't connect the dots and say hey I saw you on mobile but I don't know who you are.

Joe: 
[25:05] Find ways to tag remark you but then you.

Scot: 
[25:06] But then you transact.

Joe: 
[25:16] Stop channel it's digital to store it it's a challenge.

[25:27] Good am I think it was an accident.

Scot: 
[25:30] How do I increase my customer identifier.

Joe: 
[25:37] Be getting them to log in or getting to engage with a promotion so long before you get into cohort guidance make sure.

[25:47] How am I getting consistent measurement how am I attacking some of the consumer data problems which is a really big deal if you can get there and you know.

Scot: 
[25:55] Tricks that you can do.

Joe: 
[26:00] What you can do on testing thing.

Scot: 
[26:02] Two different audiences information variation sometimes.

Joe: 
[26:13] Can be great on hey if I give someone.

Scot: 
[26:15] How often do I see one.

Joe: 
[26:21] 2 Days Later 60 days later and tell her it's going to be in a very.

[26:26] Way to look at that.

Jason: 
[26:29] Very cool and you you touch on another topic is very near and dear to my heart.

[26:34] Talking about attribution omni-channel attribution American Eagle owns a lot of drone stores that website I presume was sort of the flagship store.

[26:48] The front door too many of those physical sores often like did you guys Implement any kind of omni-channel attribution or headed you think about.

Joe: 
[26:56] We we did a lot around on the channel That the marketing attribution was trickier for us and it's some of it was just reframing the question I am like to say round numbers that we were doing.

[27:12] Which means oh by the way 75%.
Wasn't online and if I'm the CIA.
Company and I'm looking at how I'm really thinking about what's really in a driving my.

[27:27] It sure looks like stores no matter a lot more and on.
Basis certainly that was mathematically true but I refrained the discussion we had cameras and all their stores and we could.
Into the stores in at the mall level what if we looked at this differently and said look at this from a consumer engagement standpoint how many people said put into our stores everyday and how many people set foot in our digital.
One thing is.
What stores are not buying the product and then I tried to Apples.
It's us us brand brand stores don't know no uniques it just no sanity.

[28:10] Let's take not unique's just total visits and you don't find a way to do it.

[28:15] And the interesting thing was it wasn't 75/25 now it actually flipped and it was more.

Scot: 
[28:20] 73rd Avenue.

Joe: 
[28:23] Depending on where and how we were looking at it with the majority of our daily.

Scot: 
[28:26] What actually is.

Joe: 
[28:34] Which means you can see.
The people walking into the store where already online the majority.

[28:45] Putting it in information on non offense.

[28:53] And that actually was a profound shift Ross's beginning.

Scot: 
[28:55] Beginning of recognize.

Joe: 
[28:58] Point isn't still years away when we're 50% of transactions the Tipping Point already occurred this is the primary channel for us to reach and engage with the customer.
Do you want to give it because if I would.
And online fully was realized by the person coming to the store that also means that store isn't as important as we think it is.

Scot: 
[29:20] Crediting on sale.

Joe: 
[29:22] And it starts to get very very tricky in understanding how I'm going to really be.

Scot: 
[29:27] How am I really do that with you no more.

Joe: 
[29:30] Credit and entering.

[29:34] So I ate it becomes a bit of a soft skill I think for now and connecting the dots that way where we could measure things in a single-use coupon codes and showing where the activation actually occurred or even if the inventory management I mean for us the biggest win on the channel.
It was how we exposed inventory with things like buy online ship from store which.

[29:57] But I'm in that was massive massive winter for.

Jason: 
[30:02] So like what were the big omni-channel experiences go to Wings for you you mentioned ship from the store.

Joe: 
[30:07] Is it shipping store for sure was a lot of it and if you think about it we we had a couple DC's.

[30:15] Popular but it's always a limited Supply so the idea that hey we have an item that's no longer our current sets you can get.

[30:26] Not right it's still a great product and still relatively recent but it's only available in extra extra large.

[30:34] But the idea that we actually have a unit.

Scot: 
[30:36] Somewhere are awesome store.

Joe: 
[30:38] Of that item is pretty high and at the local store level which is just very very Atomic view of managing inventory whatever assortment they have.

Scot: 
[30:47] They're just.

Joe: 
[30:49] Down 10 off 25 off move it to the back and then ultimately if they can't get it they're going to liquidate it out of the store so the idea was just simple it was how do we.

Scot: 
[30:58] Can anybody any.

Joe: 
[31:01] Existing inventory roofing supply against existing demand and it turned out to be way bigger.
When we began we didn't even know what we do this in all stores we only pick a couple hundred stores and by the time we were done it was fleet-wide every single store became it.
And it was a win-win we were given.

Scot: 
[31:19] Give me the.

Joe: 
[31:21] Customer demand.

[31:25] Our margins were actually dramatically better because we were able to move stuff much earlier in the in the in the mall.
And by the way just even you can talk about with your.
May I have a foundational belief that the notion of e-commerce as a p&l will be gone within 5 years ndia like to do this on a channel exercise we did with buy online ship from store so what if you look.

[31:51] In order to make sure the stores were truly giving a pro.
Disorders we gave the stores credit for the sale we won.

[32:02] Really great job which they did on for the like that so they're going.

Scot: 
[32:06] What is 5 *.

Joe: 
[32:09] Clearance merchandise.
Eroding because we're increasing the frequency of sales I had a clearance item that's operating cost for increasing split you.
Shipping more out of stores in general which does the the shipping an operating cost of shipping out of stores is more expensive expensive than what we could do at the distribution center and I had to manage a whole new order management system and.

[32:34] My product more guns are all getting worse.

Scot: 
[32:35] Chris sails.

Joe: 
[32:38] Credit in stores are looking good and you know how you can just took an e-commerce piano of you you'd say this isn't work.
Company level me if you think what's the definition of omni-channel with all channels we were saying increase sales we were saying higher transactions were improving on margins the lowest liquidation rates and even.

[33:03] And it just come Sunday if I'm standing in a store and they don't have.

Scot: 
[33:04] And they don't have to talk on my mobile phone.

Joe: 
[33:08] 70 Commerce a list or sell if I'm if I'm at the store if I'm on the.

Scot: 
[33:16] Very very boring day at work.

Joe: 
[33:19] And I think it's missing the point cuz the notion of trying to create a channel is Disney on.

[33:28] They don't care they're just engaging with.

Jason: 
[33:30] American Eagle sale.

Joe: 
[33:33] I think it's the wrong question and I think brands are slowly coming to grips with a chop block here it's one of the most.

Scot: 
[33:37] Hookah Bowl think I'm hearing.

Joe: 
[33:42] I think brands are finally recognizing this isn't about a different Channel or different approach or different tea and that's how do we really start to take this consumer-centric View.

Scot: 
[33:52] Could you think stores last long enough to get to this point where they rationalize the piano at Toys R Us didn't make it in the players and a lot of these guys are filing for bankruptcy now.

Joe: 
[34:00] Yeah I I don't think stores are dead I'm very bullish on stores I just think stores are going to be different and they're no longer just about convenient places to store inventory.

[34:12] I think the square footage will change I think the purpose of Discovery and and the serendipity.

Scot: 
[34:19] Experience.

Joe: 
[34:20] Brands will change but we're social beasts were looking for that human connection will look.
And I think Associates do a great job in the same day and I'd say online is going to become less mechanistic and we're going to bring more humans then I am a big fan of things like chat.

Scot: 
[34:38] About ARB Rd to Goldfield storage Grove totally virtual reality.

Joe: 
[34:42] I am yeah you know I I I think there's going to be opportunities and their categories like furniture that I think I'm very interesting where where a RV are already starting to take hold it's very interesting companies are going.
I need the idea fit and feel.

[35:01] Content and it's going to be a lot harder in the immediate future to truly do an ARB our approach for that to me.
Shannon and we keep running the math problems and to me a rvr as its a math solution.

Scot: 
[35:19] I'd much rather.

Joe: 
[35:20] Solution I'd much rather invest in most call centers have conversion rates of 30 40%.
You're nowhere near that if I can get people to call and I can understand how to staff them.
For service and get a ton of opportunity and sandwich at when as you get it in the Millennials in the youngers the younger customers they're very comfortable chat that's no different than a phone call to them and if I can engage to them.

Scot: 
[35:46] How to make silent.

Joe: 
[35:49] Commendations where use it works and if it's the same conversations you have in a store but it requires human beings to know that customer which means good CRM but date about.
10 in training in the associates you can do that digitally at scale it's just it's learning and it's it's it again it's blurry.

Scot: 
[36:09] Who am I.

Jason: 
[36:16] Joe that's great advice and it's going to be a great place to end it because it's happening again we've used up all at a lot.

[36:24] I was super grateful for you taking time to sit down and chat with us and as always is westerns want to continue the conversation they're welcome to jump on it.

[36:33] Page if you enjoyed this episode it's a great time to jump on iTunes and give us that 5-star review.

Scot: 
[36:40] Joe people want to follow you online do you have a Twitter or LinkedIn or.

Joe: 
[36:46] You can find me LinkedIn it both megibow and Twitter is megibow m e g i b o w.

Scot: 
[36:51] Cool thanks we appreciate you taking time out of the parking and you can go have a drink on us.

Jason: 
[36:57] Until next time happy commercing.

Apr 4, 2018

EP125 - Johnson & Johnson E-Com VP Sri Rajagopalan and Samir Bhavnani of 1010data 

We caught up with Samir Bhavnani of 1010data (previous appeared on Amazon Private Label Deep Dive Episode 103) at ShopTalk this year and he brought Sri Rajagopalan, VP of E-Commerce at Johnson & Johnson with him.  We cover a variety of topics including brands going direct to consumer, brands working with Marketplaces, Amazon's entry into Healthcare, and Amazon Private Label OTC.

Episode 125 of the Jason & Scot show was recorded on Tuesday, March 20, 2018.

http://jasonandscot.com

Join your hosts Jason "Retailgeek" Goldberg, SVP Commerce & Content at SapientRazorfish, and Scot Wingo, Founder and Executive Chairman of Channel Advisor as they discuss the latest news and trends in the world of e-commerce and digital shopper marketing.

New beta feature, Google Transcription:

Transcript

Jason: 
[0:25] Welcome to the Jason and Scott show this episode is being recorded on Tuesday March 20th 2018 I'm your host Jason retailgeek Goldberg and as usual I'm here with your co-host Scot Wingo.

Scot: 
[0:37] We are live live live and beautiful Las Vegas here for the shop talk show.
We're really excited to have to guest on the show too rare time we actually were able to Loop into people crazy enough to be on the show.

Jason: 
[0:52] Our listeners are getting twice their money.

Scot: 
[0:53] Yeah they are for you but double the bang-for-the-buck excited to have on the show Samir bhavnani and SRI Raja Goblin.
Samir is area vice-president of Tintin wife asking what area he covers and.
1010 data and this is his second time on the show that he was super helpful in episode 103 where we did the Deep dive on Amazon private label and he was kind enough to share some really interesting day that they have on that.
So looking forward to getting an update on that in any other interesting data topics he brings back welcome back sooner.
You're the rear Elite status of a two-timer club so there is not a three times will what will see how it goes today.

Jason: 
[1:34] Petition to be the first three.

Scot: 
[1:37] And severe was kind enough to bring along some when he found downstairs heat,
SRI who is the VP of e-commerce at this small kind of entrepreneurial brand shop called Johnson & Johnson Street has had a story career at Brand call J&J but Frito-Lay PepsiCo,
it's great to have you on the show SRI.

Sri: 
[1:57] Thank you so much that's me man that's my middle name all Style no substance but thank you for knowing that you're doing your homework in it.

Jason: 
[2:04] It's a little known fact that 100% of Scots calories come from those three branches.

Sri: 
[2:10] If previous life out of said thank you for putting my paychecks in the mail so.

Samir: 
[2:17] Drove to have you on the show one of the ways we always start the show is.

Jason: 
[2:18] On the show one of the ways we always start the show is to tell the listeners a little bit about how you started your career and kind of walk us through your matriculation to your.

Sri: 
[2:30] And some believe it or not I'm living proof that anybody can work in digital in e-commerce and let me tell you why fairly straightforward so I came to this country 25 years ago to go to school at Virginia Tech.
Dishwashing was my first job even even drove a truck for a living thank you very much hopefully this year will go to the SEC Championship.
I'm talking football not basketball to be clear so once I graduated got recruited by a market research from Ira Nielsen competitor.
Maybe someday 10 times competitor and then eventually.

Jason: 
[3:03] Daddy are they just don't know it yet.

Sri: 
[3:05] They just don't know it yet that's how the digital industry works most people don't know and so wild spending time at.
One of the leaders at Pepsi came to me a VP of sales and said dude why are you working till I die you should be working for Pepsi and I said why not give it a shot so I spend many years at PepsiCo a decade and change.
In all different functions divisions of Ben in it and sales sales leadership sales account leadership.
Last job before getting into digital retail was actually a dollar drug convenience business.
Owning the John business plan with the customers everything from the little guys like QuikTrip the gas station.
Do Dollar General then one day while having one some displays at one of my customers when I was returning as a career leadership opportunity.
I was offered why don't you start up Ecommerce for Frito-Lay and I thought it was a demotion what the heck is going on and that's 6 years ago.
And 6 years later I haven't look back and I will probably say publicly never return to a full-time brick-and-mortar retail job ever no chance no one's going to get me there.
So in the six years I've had the 49ers starting up he come for free oh what is things I realize is when you see you ask you.
I was registering having doing the truck once about that when you see you ask you figure out a way we had 30 days we had to figure out a strategy lo and behold we started scripting it driving it.
And I got to do that for you I get to do it all over again it down sitting down too and it's been 3 quick years I got 11 days left to complete three years magical three years that's my private life of an entrepreneur got a record label it solve all your records.

[4:42] I'm also in real estate development in Texas and also another business that's my middle name.

[4:50] Hang out with you guys a lot more.

Scot: 
[4:54] I'm a big fan of Indra nooyi.

Sri: 
[4:58] Many times here's a funny story for the listeners her daughter that actually learn dance from my wife a couple times.

Scot: 
[5:08] Yeah. One of my favorite podcast other than Jason Scott shows Freakonomics they just did a whole series of out and what does CEO and they're really highlighted her and she was just very well spoken about you know how how she thinks about being a CEO and ended up being a woman CEO and all that stuff is very she's very awesome.
Leader.

Sri: 
[5:25] So let me give you a another story out there and enjoy please don't kill me or listeners don't kill me for giving this up humility.
Indoor practice in humidity right so I think before I got promoted from a director to a senior director we had a rule back then she was a CFO CEO and we had to interview with her,
so I know you would tell her she don't ask me about my background and I casually mentioned that that. My wife was running a classical Indian dance school so I mentioned,
she starts asking me questions of course I had no clue and I don't knows the truth I have no clue but I made something up she said give me your wife's phone number like that here to here it is.
Two weeks later my wife calls me and says hey do you know who was at our house today I'm like who.
Should lay in there and we was at the house and I'm like why and she said hey she was sitting here sitting on the floor with a daughter watching her daughter actually dance because she wanted her to learn classical.
In and that was in the afternoon on a weekday and I'm like Mom humility business leader.
Mobile one of the most powerful 1400 leaders in the one of the most powerful women leaders in the world that's what life's about.

Scot: 
[6:29] Your your record label I assume does it have some to do with Indian music seems like that's.

Sri: 
[6:37] Although maybe I shouldn't say that because my we start a record label solve all your records because my daughter was an American Idol finalist years ago the name is Rhea Raj and she works or with DJs all over the world collab Integra going to Belgium.
Next Wednesday to do a music video so she's got her own channel YouTube falling things of that nature so it's and she sings Poppin EDM.
So she actually doesn't know the Indian language came a lot but although now with her Regional field Indian DJs of started to reach out.
And I have a project on my hand a text message from my wife this morning then ask me for 4 lines in Hindi.

Scot: 
[7:17] Nice.

Sri: 
[7:18] Indian DJ.

Scot: 
[7:19] Deathrhyme.

Sri: 
[7:20] I hope I can figure that out although I did tell you all Style no substance rhyme is about style I can make this work.

Scot: 
[7:23] All Style no substance.

Sri: 
[7:28] Hey guys if I didn't think so mean for having me on the show it wouldn't be right so thank you for connecting me with Jason Scott.

Samir: 
[7:34] Got her all doing this.

Scot: 
[7:35] Yeah you could that take over my job the showrunner here so so I can so tough one.

Samir: 
[7:39] The bar is very very well.

Scot: 
[7:41] Show me a better job already cool so let's talk a little bit about J&J so you've been 3 years on the job when they started did they already have an e-commerce initiative or are you kind of got it from Ground Zero.

Sri: 
[7:55] So when I when they started looking for somebody to come and start this up change it stop ship that Amazon that was the only real business if it a lot of issues with quality things of that nature is the mutual decision to not have the relationship so we were.
Really experimenting in DTC.
Truly practicing on TVC Omni was too tiny to kinda really count so the goal was to start up all pieces of you come so that's Omni that's the walmart.com.
Target.com truly put and then obviously Amazon.
That and B2B b2c with lady. She out now pretty well you should check out neutrogena.com and rogaine.com through Commerce and action not just the website.
We've managed to upgrade those platforms to demandware for the plug-in they don't pay me to endorse him but it actually works and it's pretty cool.

Scot: 
[8:46] That sells horse e-commerce Club.

Sri: 
[8:48] Thank you for being technically at.

Samir: 
[8:51] You don't know how I rock.

Jason: 
[8:52] It is that you now have the entire body of knowledge that Scott has of e-commerce platform.

Sri: 
[8:59] All substance lifestyle.
So be ready to start it up while it's going to offend people if I take from scratch but the reality is that we had to do wait to put together a team really get going in all directions.
We're fortunate business is gone consumers have responded retailers of partnered we found amazing vendors to partner of it and let me just put out an honest truth out there in the journey and e-com.
You can't do it yourself you're going to have to partner with vendors and in this case unlike popular belief and Roi and all that stuff more is better.
I'm literally here for 24 hours I flew in last night I flattened that I all I'm doing other than that shows me to vendor.

Scot: 
[9:39] Go to Silver folks that aren't familiar with J&J and even I have limited knowledge I know health and beauty is a big category for you guys and then.
You guys and I think there's a huge drug division but that's more like a prescription there some over-the-counter what other are you guys in the pet category what other and snacks I don't know what all categories are in the.

Sri: 
[10:01] When you think of Jace J&J list three parts today and one is Pharma so that's your classic prescription medication you go to a CVS or Walgreens or Rite Aid any retailer deals in prescriptions in You by JJ products.
Then you have the medical devices section so everything from.
Instead of putting the heart to Diabetic Care which of course we announced for sale recently it's publicly announced and then there's the consumer sector I'm in the consumer sector.
If you depend if you start dissecting the consumer sector think of it as three different pieces.
Does the beauty care piece popular bands are clean and clear of course the big Neutrogena Aveeno is another one getting a lot of popularity especially good baby I'm second pieces to self care.
Area which is I'm sure you've heard of allergy relief which is Zyrtec.

Scot: 
[10:50] Big fan.

Sri: 
[10:51] Pain medication Tylenol Band-Aid for wound care.
Listerine for oral care and of course the legendary famous every mom wants to have it in her kind of in her bathroom for her child daughter or son whatever it might be Johnson's Baby.
What forms the portfolio of Johnson & Johnson.

Scot: 
[11:10] No More Tears.

Sri: 
[11:11] No More Tears hey good morning.

Samir: 
[11:13] And pictures bottle.

Scot: 
[11:16] It's a strong band when they just like pops right in your head like that.

Sri: 
[11:18] If you come by and visit us sometime I'll walk you through the baby Hall of Fame but does the advertising which started 9 I think somewhere Midway through this last century No More Tears and we got a whole Hall of Fame picture story on it.

Scot: 
[11:30] The interrupted you Siri going to the 3 I got so excited about the baby stuff.

Sri: 
[11:36] Mega brands of course there are many other brands outside of the mega band as well.
So the change that's really happened is all of these man's scale in store due to the consumer shipping habits.
Many of them almost all of them about online now they're not just bought an Amazon although Amazon is a big piece of it consumers want a choice Mom want to charge battery shop.
And I truly living in the where to buy in ready shop which is not just one retailer one place but we can order as well as Omni as well as Amazon well as deals.

Jason: 
[12:11] Obviously all those brands are sold Wholesale in store and online a few of those Brands you're now selling d2c online.

Sri: 
[12:23] Neutrogena.
Of course under Neutrogena that many subcategories there's acne cleansers there's acne care that facial moisturizer therapy that body lotions and and body care.
I'm so when you think of the brand it's all label Neutrogena but it's many multiple subcategories and then there's the I would say hair restoration Rogaine.
We're doing do you see on that one as well but don't think.

Jason: 
[12:48] Why is everyone looking at me when they say Rogaine.

Scot: 
[12:50] Women women need their sponsorship on the show.

Sri: 
[12:53] Let me tell you guys something Rogaine actually works when people ask me that but the key to using and winning with Rogaine is using it before someone goes completely bald because the formula needs something to work on not just dead skin.

Jason: 
[13:06] Now they're even looking to Me Harder.
The end of things interesting to me about your role as a lot of cpgs when they have e-commerce.

[13:16] I'm always curious what they mean because sometimes what they mean is help our wholesale brand sell stuff on their e-commerce Ides better sometimes they mean like launch are direct-to-consumer in your exclusively want responsible for the direct to consumer.
My perception is that you have sort of both sides of that is at.

Sri: 
[13:34] To touch everything and I think it's by Design so when we started this up three years we made a conscious Choice we'll touch everything because we had to influence and build an ecosystem.
Ecosystem is not just the numbers and sales right it's the content piece of it so yes I do part of it it's the sem part of it you go back to yours and Israelis were not common household words.
Now they are so different place and Diamond I'm sitting with experts over here Tree Experts so all of this makes sense I still sit inside in an hour.
External parties Etc with these words don't make sense right Soviet attacks the entire ecosystem of my belief is over the course of time though the only way any cpg company will be truly successful.
Content needs to be on that the Innovation cycle so when a product is born.
A brand needs your own content from scratch so they get just like this focus on mailing packaging and store digital is just a piece of it the digital content and that way I see it was used in packaging how about that.

Jason: 
[14:33] I mean arguably like packaging was in original form of SEO.
One more level sending question about J&J misses super.
The sum of your Brand's you guys wholesale through Amazon is that correct so you have you sell some some Brands 1p and are you doing any 3-piece sales on Amazon.

Sri: 
[14:53] Yeah what a partner with the pharmapacks I think it's a known fact.
We're not the only ones pharmapacks is a scale TP on Amazon I think even Amazon if you heard egg Broussard today.
I'm actually suggesting that manufacturers should be on FBI platforms things of that nature my belief is an e-commerce strategies a little bit of everything just as Amazon is a piece of the strategy.
Amazon call to the one. Nation trip we're very similar to brick-and-mortar retailers funny as it may be for you guys to believe.
It's the relationship management is not very different right buying products in bulk.
Putting truckloads of products in Amazon warehouses and then working with Amazon in the right promotional levers for the consumer right 3p I'm also looking into being an API Subs if it's appropriate because.
Sometimes a given skew or a brand or a product.
May not be a fit for the 1p business we might choose to launch in the different way different fashion things of that nature same thing. But my Amazon sometimes that may be the best platform then they're developing the criteria now but I believe.
To win the space and be a leader in the space you got to touch everything it can't be a one-and-done story.

Jason: 
[16:02] For sure we talked a lot about that on the show that you need a portfolio that there's not a.

[16:08] That's all any of these problems and I increasingly worsening brand sort of had that hybrid relationship with with Amazon in particular where there's a 1p and 3p component.

Samir: 
[16:19] It's also important right to not have all your eggs in the Amazon basket and having some kind of X Amazon outside of Amazon strategy something and I'm starting to see a lot more.
Perfect segue so that we can have a good foundation on understanding of where J&J is on their digital.

Jason: 
[16:37] Journey.

Samir: 
[16:39] I want to go back to Samir who introduced 1010data last time you're on the show but just as a super quick Refresher.
Ginormous panel of consumers you get to see all of their digital spending behavior and so you have this super rich source of data that you charge way too much money to J&J and us.
You nailed it,
so we just stopped we just looked at last year's gross of 2017 numbers compared to 2016 and we came and Tim and I came on.
Last year we talked about Amazon private label was happening there that's certainly been one of the hottest topics I would save the last couple years.
And what the data shows is that.
Private label over alright friends like Kirkland and Amazon elements and we're up over 100% over the over the prior-year.
Which is an astounding amount right and that has a very big impact on not only disruptive Brands but also on establish Perez.

Scot: 
[17:48] Yeah there's a backdrop where retail is growing three to 4% e-commerce 15 to 20 and then you have Amazon 30 so something going hundred percent is really you know if your 3 accessing Amazon that that's pretty darn.

Samir: 
[18:01] It's it's incredible we haven't seen growth so down to do to see you know just massive growth in the online Channel I think I sent you we were talking earlier and.
We break things out into categories and subcategories right you can get as fine as you know like.
Dry dog food versus wet dog food rats type of Branding Iron you can also me start looking at but if you look at Petcare was up 57% Billion Dollar industry industry and it's just continuing.

Scot: 
[18:30] Just private label Are All That Girl.

Samir: 
[18:31] All pet care all pet care I didn't I didn't break out or something.

Sri: 
[18:39] How about this the guy knows his number is.

Samir: 
[18:40] And then the other 50% categories food and beverage writes online grocery is is something that.
1010 is a reputation for short of being the innovators and tracking online grocery and then your category baby 48% growth last year so that's that's very impressive.
And then running out personal cares 42% General Health is 26% in the Cosmetics was actually pretty slow at 15%.

Scot: 
[19:09] Awesome and then so this is kind of interesting so private label growing a hundred percent you're obviously you know in the world of Brands how how do you guys think about this private label thing does not worry you or your kind of like this is a little worrisome what what should we do about it.

Sri: 
[19:24] The honest answer to that is personally I don't worry at all then they'll give you I think that's two pieces of the story.
Please number one is straightforward private label is existed for a few decades nothing you and you look at private labels role in the category it's very clear to me why retailers have.
Private label and scale to a certain extent right I think the industry is panicking a lot kind of looking at Amazon private label and saying oh my gosh.
It is going to do something to my brand equity in my question to Brand marketers is very straightforward one.
You build equity over 20-30 years and if you're going to lose confidence over one announcement then are you sure you're doing the right things to build equity in the first place.
I have the Supreme confidence that even Amazon private label is a brand at the end of the day they're going to depend on a brand new salad that's one piece of the story,
I think bands with all these have equity in Amazon private label the wall Toby equity-based II pieces.
Manufacturers are such over the course of the time haven't really spent a lot of time in a looking at should they be partnering with Radeon actually developing private label I don't mean just.
A manufacturing a product in a factory and putting it on truck but only marketing elements off it actually cleaning that kitty for the brand.
The Experience manufacturers having brand Equity wouldn't retailers want to partner with manufacturers in the marketing arm of it as well so I see it as.
Play this is awesome why Panic it's an opportunity for every manufacturer to leverage the good ones on figure it out.

Samir: 
[20:53] I do I think it's interesting like I totally agree like.

Jason: 
[20:57] Gables been around a long time and I'm not sure that it's dramatically more threatening now than it ever was.

[21:04] Threatening is the second thing you mentioned is that retailers are now shipping a focus from Pride.

Samir: 
[21:07] Retail Focus from private label owned brands in.

Jason: 
[21:11] Brands in me that's a more direct competitor with you in that wide example I was like to use cuz its most extreme is Alexa is not a private label Sony Bluetooth speaker it's the mar.

Samir: 
[21:19] Alexa is not a private label Sony Bluetooth speaker it's the market-leading best product in the category that's wrinkly.

Jason: 
[21:25] In the category that frankly kicks on.

Samir: 
[21:28] If that becomes the truancy Walmart watching grown.

Jason: 
[21:31] Quincy Walmart launching their own mattress brand in like they're investing in March.

Samir: 
[21:35] Marketing and landing pages and you know their own unique attributes.

Jason: 
[21:41] Trend continues.

Samir: 
[21:43] And Amazon says what are the gaps in baby care and where should we eat you know build our own brand that potentially is a new threat that.

Jason: 
[21:46] Where should we eat unit build our own brand that potentially is a new threat that puts the the traditional National brands in the retailers that at all more at odds in that used to be.

Sri: 
[21:58] It's actually an opportunity to fly.
I'm at before we started the show we were discussing advertising over here right and how did you know this completely changed advertising and morphed retail over the course of time and the survivors and the ones are actually flashing of the Wonder don't confirm.
In a basically marked and mended ways and said here's how I'm going to play it out I don't see this as any different if we walked in and said there's only one way to build brand equity.
Good luck if we want to confirm good luck they'll be rules to confirm they'll be places to confirm.
But they'll be places to seek the opportunity goat cheese blade Out Create unique new Partnerships do things if I ask you guys you go back 10 years in history.
Weed for one to be sitting here at a suite in Las Vegas watching the mountains and actually recording a podcast about private label you guys would have left but here we are we're doing.
Because you decided tomorrow and do it I see it as an exact same YouTube it's a huge opportunity the ones who are going to exploited or going to fly.

Scot: 
[23:00] Little bit so we talk a little bit about Amazon but it wouldn't be a Jason Scott show if we didn't go into a little bit more one thing that happened about 3 months ago is it was revealed that Amazon has filed to be a drugstore essentially in like 20 to 30 States,
you know these days we'll never ever something Amazon happens like CVS and Walgreens Rite Aid in all the stocks crater 20% you know you guys are a really large Drug Company,
what would you think about Amazon becoming effectively of Next Generation online drugstore.

Sri: 
[23:29] So if you thought about the actual.
Industry of healthcare Healthcare is a lot more than just the medication element of it that Healthcare Providers involved because they made CP is that hospitals involved.
The ecosystem of healthcare is very complex highly regulated in this country.
It's not something that'll Morphin 3 days but neither CPT more than 3 days so I actually welcome.
New players coming in trying to change Healthcare you got to take the winner is at the end of the day I'd all of us are doing things in our lives today to deliver a win for the ultimate person that you're all touch with the car.

Jason: 
[24:07] I thought you were talking about my wife. You okay.

Sri: 
[24:12] At home that's what you deliver.

Samir: 
[24:14] My main focus.

Sri: 
[24:17] Now I have an excuse to get to be there to listen to the show.
Remember she's in record label entertainment Property Management so I got to get around that you can respect but now you give me a tease and thank you sir far to client so.
Have back on Healthcare right back on Healthcare so I welcome the digitization of healthcare.
Honest truth be told letting very few people realize that there's a lot of Health Care advertising already taking place to delete a lot of programmatic already taken place.
Digitally as long as the ecosystem is delivering a win for the consumer I think I'll roll.
All of our roles is to find a way to participate make it better for the consumer so I welcome all those opportunities.

Samir: 
[24:59] I totally agree asked me like one of the funnest part of the whole.

Jason: 
[25:00] I totally agree I talk to me like one of the funniest part of the whole industries that we can't just follow the Playbook that people in falling for the last 10 years so I am now.

Samir: 
[25:06] But I'm buying for the last 10 years so I imagine since Samir brought you here that you are.

Jason: 
[25:13] 1010 data.

Sri: 
[25:14] Yes so so mien and I are looking at creative ways on Parklane looking at not just Amazon's data but also looking at me Channel and we'll have we had a chat today standing outside the door waiting for you all about DTC.
And looking at not just a POS data and sales and things of that nature without Denton could also getting in getting to share.
And actually help manufacturers try and understand their role in the category if you listen to some me earlier you talked about 42% growth 58% growth.
48%. These are no ordinary numbers guys I mean the last time CPD in retail solve 42 + 48% it's been awhile.
So somebody can have some real fun here if he chooses to and I have a strong suspicion he does if you don't.

Scot: 
[25:58] How to say it just come here the Jason Scott show takes 10% of every deal kind of consummated before after or during the podcast.

Sri: 
[26:07] How many minutes before so somebody's going to check in if its 8 minutes before I think he's going over here but 12 minutes I'd be worried if I was some here.

Scot: 
[26:15] We might live a very long cookies.

Sri: 
[26:18] It Last Forever.

Jason: 
[26:19] 30-day attribution window.

Sri: 
[26:21] Buy actually clean up my cookies every time it's automated now so.

Jason: 
[26:24] It's cute that you think we're still using cookies.

Sri: 
[26:29] Sometimes better than cpg I told you also have no substance you guys weren't listening.
Sometimes it gets exposed but back on the partnership right I truly believe there's a place for a.
Data vendor and I shouldn't say they don't like morphing into an lyrics inside things of that nature.
Category growth basket level transaction I'm short and turned it over the course of time of play to all the strengths and actually bring that level of relevancy.
2D cpg industry.

Scot: 
[27:02] Sedated what was kind of rough on that for a minute so you know you're,
you're kind of second generation on this what's your dashboard so you know you guys have Brazilian skews you're on all these Channel summer 153p you have like a dashboard that you look at this, how you're doing at how do you think about that.

Sri: 
[27:21] I look at it all and probably not not your best Benchmark because remember I'm also brick and mortar train.
And so I'm no longer interested in the dashboard. Just give me data and says yes what sales was.
And just what it was percent change your logo and here's a Cheddar's percent change you to go to in my eyes that's the old school way of measuring which still works in other places it doesn't work in this space in this space.
Cher alone is not enough because you're measuring share of an unlimited shelf anyway so that changes and if you know the Amazon platform you know that.
Number of products that show up changes on a minute-by-minute basis depending on who launched who got killed things of that nature. So for me it's all about the inciting LX base to me I'll rest when I can find out why she's buying it as in the consumer.
What's transaction-level understanding what prompted to buy it what the behavioral drivers are.
As well as a Jason categories opportunities what kind of promotional offer she's looking for what would drive her to want to make a purchase when they should come online just to learn is it an innovation she wants to learn about is good more than that for example in the baby category.
A lot of these are Chick-fil-A's today Beauty care Lottery search requested a wound care does less.
So getting to that level of detail I call it like drivers of the business truly getting to the causal factors yesterday's Marley was display was featured in store here it's like a complete swing it's called SEO Base Montana.
I see him we talk about Royce on our way it's really decomposing and getting to that level that's the dashboard I look at.

Scot: 
[28:53] I can cook some more forward-looking versus the the the so so when you first started your career at Frito-Lay,
imagine e-commerce looks like the sidebar kind of wacky hobby you experiment and now at at mini Brands I don't know about J&J but you know I'm a big CNBC nut and you know you see things like Dollar Shave Club being acquired,
P&G has an activist in there that's like disrupting the board and he claims that they're not doing enough to be direct and that kind of thing so you probably went from being in a.
Running this kind of cool little thing on the side that no one really.
Focused on so now I'm ajan is pretty bright Spotlight on it does does the major role at a company like JJ get a fair amount of his ability up into the board level or is it still kind of a you know an interesting hobbies out how to.
Where where is that in the spectrum of those things.

Sri: 
[29:38] What a great question right I can promise you e-commerce is on the radar of our CEO.
Off of regional Chairman's off a cross-functional leadership I'm lucky that I work in a company that I get all their support to make this happen and I think you all know better than I do that it's not about Johnson & Johnson any large public company Wall Street analysts are asking about e-commerce.
So we do have those conversations with investors and it's the right thing to do because it's a part of business that's growing and it's the future of retail in many ways.
I want to see the only way to tell what shape the future it's a big place and I'm sure investors are very well aware that.
And I'm fortunate that my leadership support me in this journey and we've been able to build a good business model that works for everybody.

Scot: 
[30:23] Another kind of questions are there the the cost to create a new brand is going to lay down so you're at chop talk you know we're talking like Jason had kind of are on the program we've seen,
baywater and all these branches can I get born in this new digital age,
and it used to cost you a millions millions of dollars to create a brand and companies like yours would go and do the $59 ad campaign and all that now that causes come down as a House of brands do you guys does that.
Did you find yourself looking at those things going to maybe acquire them or does it give you now the flexibility entrepreneur or intrapreneurial and start Brands inside or.
Where are both of you guys think about that.

Sri: 
[31:00] It's a bit of both to be honest.
I'm better this reason why Dollar Shave Club was acquired it wasn't just a product it wasn't the dollar razor on it was capabilities then you start thinking about jet.com it's not very different right after I've spent a lot of time but jet.com,
Executives folks over there I mean you're talking about some of the people who know e-commerce inside out.
So I think talent and expertise is still growing in the industry.
And cpg companies will have to lean on buying some of that talent and expertise and that's why some of these Acquisitions happen but the wonderful thing that's happened about Brandon koobatian is.
If you go back to the brick-and-mortar world.
To incubate a new brand you're going to have to trade something on the planogram and 5 out of 10 times it's a brand that isn't doing so well that you own.
And what change in this world is you don't have to make that trade you can launch it you can do true test and learns that you can and I was listening to I believe it was again. From Amazon you can fail fast you can fail cheap.
And you can make decisions in record time and you can fix things.

Scot: 
[32:03] Exploding kittens Lee.

Sri: 
[32:06] Since I didn't go by the way I didn't know what exploding can.

Jason: 
[32:09] No I was little I was a little afraid to find out.

Sri: 
[32:12] So was I so was I.

Scot: 
[32:12] You guys got your your family love it's really fun it's kinda like to know.

Sri: 
[32:18] I don't ever play that very often my twelve-year-old Laura and I.

Samir: 
[32:22] I'm really good at you know.

Sri: 
[32:25] Have you ever tried a double stack two concerts at the same time.

Jason: 
[32:29] My family are big card sheets so it's like you constantly have to watch text make sure that someone is not slipping other cards under the car they play it's very sad.

Sri: 
[32:37] I wonder if he'll what happens on the family table but I assume there's a little bit of element of that at every table.

Scot: 
[32:42] Yes brings out the competition in the family.
Sweetheart, curveball for you. So we had to listen or question come in and it was really interesting where if I could summarize the listener kind of said all right.
Everyone says Amazon's like 60% of e-commerce they're growing 30% Walmart's growing you know.
Between 25 and 60% of another quarter eBay is growing 10%. Where would you add all that up you get to kind of like.
25 or 30% and then we always say we always rely on like, Square data the Forester data that says e-commerce is going 15 to 18%.
I come to the conclusion that that they're probably wrong and when I talk to some people today the industry you know they.
The what the devil's argument is they say that a lot of that data is keyed off of the US Census Data that comes out that they kind of they didn't take their data and correlate to that.
And then there's a lot of people that believe that that Census Data just fundamentally wrong and effectively understating e-commerce you have a point of view on that order.

Samir: 
[33:45] Is it on the data I don't know I can't look at the data just sort of quote any sort of specific numbers but generally speaking in a few look at whoever is putting up numbers with her, score.
Whoever any panel data has strengths and weaknesses it's a reality right that you deal with within the space me and my contention based on what we've seen is that stuff. That sounds low to me.
The end.

Scot: 
[34:09] What do you think Ecommerce is growing like a range is.

Samir: 
[34:11] I mean I I still think it's it's got to be God be grown in the thirty 40% range Head Soccer.
Every major category is moving online more and more the asps of the products that sell online are higher than the ESPYs that you see in the store.
There's a sticky Factor there's Discovery Factor whether whether it's a DDC like looking at neutrogena.com or whether it's something classic like just going to Amazon.
More and more of my purchases are happening there when I think you know probably have one of the stable is the same scenario.

Scot: 
[34:46] SRI does that freak you out you're kind of in a pie in a world where you're worried about 15% e-commerce growth and making sure your your efforts grow that faster faster and what if the bar really is 20 to 30%.

Sri: 
[34:57] Get to Wild swing by category I think the overall notion that e-commerce is going fast if any of us are debating.
Statically Pharmacy so it doesn't scare me at all I think if you start looking at what.

Samir: 
[35:10] Looking at what a role is to the consumer we need to go at that.

Sri: 
[35:13] We need to go at that place so we can deliver value for the consumer and delivered Brands the daily.

Samir: 
[35:17] And I and keep Pace with their needs and demand so I don't get it at all I ask.

Sri: 
[35:19] In the hands keep face with their needs and demands so I don't feel it at all. I see all of this as a giant opportunity for a cpg companies to take leadership and do what's right for the time.

Samir: 
[35:31] Cilantro.

Scot: 
[35:32] What was the future of cpgs is it is it like half direct half wholesale no he's really kind of you know you haven't experienced any brand at Costco that's different than the Amazon that's different than the rogaine.com.
If you would what's your and even outside of J&J if you know I don't want you to give us any secrets we could do that so I'd appreciate it.
It would switch your vision for like 3 years were sitting here again gazing at the beautiful mountains with what we talkin about.

Sri: 
[35:58] In the last 3 years right in any comp the strategy for today doesn't apply 6 months from now and business planning that I kind of plan down and thought just yesterday I was kind of talking to.
Star Chief customer officer in terms of what's the next evolution of e-commerce that we need to focus on right and we both can card.

Samir: 
[36:18] Any strategy.

Sri: 
[36:19] But you were kind of buildings got about a 6 month old.
I'm and if I look at a few years down the line where is business going to be done I think I'd be fooling you and your listeners if I said.
It's going to be only one way versus anything else it's going to be a mix of it all it's going to be vacant lot is not going away first of all make a big him or is here to stay it's going to have it.

Samir: 
[36:34] Vicki Lawrence is here to stay it's going to have a distinct gold.

Sri: 
[36:41] Fulfilling a distinct Mission depending on the category I see.

Samir: 
[36:45] Did you see me.

Sri: 
[36:46] I see your milk runs some of the girls that aren't being preserved even in the long run in a bacon.
Those that have no touch feel.

Samir: 
[36:55] Probably going more online.

Sri: 
[36:56] Doing more online over the course of action they probably I think they will go online over the course of time and then when you think of distribution method.
Companies are going to have to learn that we talked about the one p3p FBA you know being part of all these models when the retailer selling.

Samir: 
[37:10] Part of all these models when the retailers are here. They want you to be part of it experiment learn and I see the future.

Sri: 
[37:15] Learn and I see the future starting many things not just one.

Samir: 
[37:20] SRI it sounds like you've been in partner meetings most of your time here vendor meetings so I'm guessing you haven't had a chance to do I consume a lot of the content for or walk the show for trying my best.

Sri: 
[37:32] I actually spent trying my best not to do vendor meetings in restaurants and bars actually go to.
The vendors to throw truly trying to understand who they are not meet with one person like classically a business development person truly but truly get into the meat of what product they have things of that nature my belief is on.

Samir: 
[37:50] My belief is on that timer.

Sri: 
[37:52] Belief is always been.
Hunger and appetite and curiosity for the spaces the way we will be able to skip history in the space and its conferences like this that you find that a median that comes in.
People holding the next thing you know there's an opportunity.

Samir: 
[38:10] Are there any key takeaways or themes that have kind of emerged in your mind from the show.

Sri: 
[38:17] So I think there's good news and bad news over there I think the bad news is.

Samir: 
[38:21] I think a lot of.

Sri: 
[38:22] The stuff that I saw is still econ 101 content.

Samir: 
[38:26] Blackboard.

Sri: 
[38:27] Basics of Commerce SEO sem the good news is I still think there's a ton of opportunity and all those faces so I've definitely.

Samir: 
[38:31] Good news is I still think there's a ton of opportunity in all of those faces so I'm definitely met with.

Sri: 
[38:40] The show where does geeking out and what the next set of data needs and insights needs are and where we need to go and things of that nature. This is the place where stuff like that happens so I've seen plenty of.

Samir: 
[38:52] Samir have you seen any other trends of the show that are not jump out of you everyone has been talking it just seems it's been such an Amazon centered focus and.
I'm waiting I'm waiting to hear some of the outside of Amazon things.
It really reminds me to Amazon today is like Walmart was in the 90s right everybody everybody scared of them they're putting the screws to all the vendors it's it's a difficult you know it's a difficult spot they're trying to they're trying to grab as much as they can.
And.
I'm very eager to see Innovation from companies outside of Amazon so freedom for example for the things you know if anyone saw the.
Mark Laurie interview today you know some of the things at Walmart trying to do our.
Pretty significant right in there they're placing their placing big bats to show that they're serious.
About going toe-to-toe and they've got a lot of assets disposals lot of smart people as you were saying sure you know your hiring people some of these Acquisitions are just to get the get the development Allen.
And so those are some of the things that I'm saying.
I think that is a good wrap up and that's actually going to be a good place to rap because it's happen again we've used up all our a lot of time but if you want to continue the conversation we encourage you to meet us over,
on our Facebook page and we love to chat more if you enjoy this show if you're sure appreciate if you jump on iTunes and give us that 5-star review.

Scot: 
[40:18] In Sri how can people find you online you were talking about blogging earlier.

Sri: 
[40:22] Evereve social platform mankind can conceive so the easiest way is LinkedIn I actually block a lot about e-commerce and Amazon.

Samir: 
[40:28] Got some great stuff.

Scot: 
[40:31] Company mostly publishing LinkedIn.

Samir: 
[40:34] So I have my own bed.

Sri: 
[40:35] So I have my own website but I'm not ready.

Samir: 
[40:38] But it won't turn on.

Sri: 
[40:39] Facebook Instagram Tweed the whole gamut and now I will make sure to go to Json NDSU.

Scot: 
[40:47] And we will put links to your LinkedIn and on our show notes to come out with podcast with folks want to go there you're going to make a lot of LinkedIn friends that will help your numbers there.

Samir: 
[40:56] Samir are you still at me on Tinder is that still that's what.

Scot: 
[41:03] Seriously you got you publish lot of great stuff to you prefer people go to.

Samir: 
[41:05] Yeah I link to LinkedIn LinkedIn is this is the easiest easiest one for me.

[41:13] Kazakh feeling me.

Scot: 
[41:18] Goalie really appreciate guys taking time out of your busy schedule to be on the show.

Sri: 
[41:23] Hey thank you so much for having me in the first place always fun I think I might get my strong belief we're going to shape the industry together one can't do it alone so genuinely thank you thank you so much for connecting me.

Samir: 
[41:33] Thank you so much for connecting you Jason.

Jason: 
[41:36] I'll give that a amen and until next time happy commercing.

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